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Old 06-29-2018, 05:33 AM   #1
oldsilver
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55 defend 2/5nl

CO reg 700 raises 20
Hero SB 900 call 5s5c

Flop 3h 3c 4h
Hero leads 30
CO calls

Turn Ts
Hero leads 55
CO calls

River Td
Hero leads 75
CO raises 320

CO range pre is wide, 25%+
Perfect flop and brick turn would suggest only pp range beats us, not much 3x there

I don't often lead here but it's a simple way to shut down most of V range and get a little value v the rest provided we barrel brick turns

otr can we find enough in V range to call? seems a value heavy type, but not sure what he's repping with a raise
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Old 06-29-2018, 08:10 AM   #2
AllTheCheese
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Re: 55 defend 2/5nl

Fold pre.

Man, this is a terrible line. He calls flop with something like A9+, A5s, A2s, 56s, KQ, PPs, a range that flips against your hand. He raises a bunch of heart draws, which you just get owned by because you cannot continue facing a raise oop. Your donk reps nothing strong, and he can blast off with a variety of holdings either for thin value or as a bluff.

Turn barrel eliminates worse hands other than heart draws from his range, meaning he crushes you when he calls the turn. Firing 75 otr, you might as well be lighting the money on fire. The diminishing sizing street by street (70% pot, 50% pot, 30% pot) is so bad, it's almost like a level. You're hoping your opponent believes you can't be this bad to be turning your hand so obviously faceup.
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Old 06-29-2018, 10:01 AM   #3
ChrisV
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Re: 55 defend 2/5nl

Quote:
Originally Posted by AllTheCheese View Post
Fold pre.

Man, this is a terrible line. He calls flop with something like A9+, A5s, A2s, 56s, KQ, PPs, a range that flips against your hand. He raises a bunch of heart draws, which you just get owned by because you cannot continue facing a raise oop. Your donk reps nothing strong, and he can blast off with a variety of holdings either for thin value or as a bluff.

Turn barrel eliminates worse hands other than heart draws from his range, meaning he crushes you when he calls the turn. Firing 75 otr, you might as well be lighting the money on fire. The diminishing sizing street by street (70% pot, 50% pot, 30% pot) is so bad, it's almost like a level. You're hoping your opponent believes you can't be this bad to be turning your hand so obviously faceup.
Pretty much this with the exception of "fold pre".

I have no idea what "shut down most of V's range" means. You mean stop him bluffing? Cause uhhh we don't want to do that.
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Old 06-29-2018, 10:02 AM   #4
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Re: 55 defend 2/5nl

He's repping with a raise a T btw. Any T. Also 33 and 44.
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Old 06-29-2018, 01:39 PM   #5
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Re: 55 defend 2/5nl

I don't have a calling range from the SB vs CO and especially not vs a 4x open with no antes so... ya I dunno man.

Going with above... I don't know how our leading range is going to work on the flop. I understand that 55 benefits literally the most out of any hand from betting, in terms of denying equity to all his overcards, but I feel like if we lead this flop we're just asking to be owned; we have a range disadvantage on this board, the board is dynamic, and we're oop. Either way I don't like the big sizing if we decide to lead and I would start with a check

Turn is just spew imo. After you 75%~ flop you folded out a lot of the hands you already wanted to fold out and now if you're betting turn again you're just isolating yourself against better pairs, good flush draws and 4x with not as much of a reason to deny equity as we are on the flop. If you do decide to bet it should be like 25% of pot.

Why are you betting river?? Hoping to get hero'd by exactly Ax? Your line doesn't rep much bluffs here lol, specially with your sizing as played.

Because I have no idea what your call pre lead flop range is I can't really help ya on this river spot as played but if you plunked me down in this spot I'd probably fold vs a random 2/5 player.
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Old 06-29-2018, 02:26 PM   #6
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Re: 55 defend 2/5nl

I think calling pre is fine, they are 700 effective so you are getting good odds to set mine. I would play flop as a check because it's going to be hard to balance a leading range and you will likely have marginals like 55-88. If you check your whole range, you can check-call with your middling pairs, some draws like 56s, and check-raise with some good flush draws, value hands like 33-44 and your better overpairs 88-TT.

As for the rest of the hand, I would definitely not bet turn and definitely not bet river. The reason you're in this spot is because you bloated the flop with a marginal hand so I would focus more on flop/turn play.
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Old 06-29-2018, 02:41 PM   #7
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Re: 55 defend 2/5nl

This is an old man tourney donk tries cash games line. Raise pre
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Old 06-29-2018, 04:09 PM   #8
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Re: 55 defend 2/5nl

This hand is spew. If you were the BB and the raise were smaller it would probably be okay to have a leading range on 334. In this spot you don't rep anything to prevent villain from floating/raising you aggressively. You have literally 0 combos of 3x except quads.

On the river this hand is clearly not strong enough to value bet, and you're not folding better hands because you still rep close to nil except a flop bluff that just made tens full.

Villain does rep Tx, unless you happen to know he wouldn't float the flop. If he doesn't float the flop much its even harder to find bluffs than value bets. I'd fold river. You have much better hands to bluffcatch with.
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Old 06-29-2018, 04:30 PM   #9
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Re: 55 defend 2/5nl

I would 3b or fold pre, mostly folding though.

Otf i’d x/c, donking makes no sense.

Ott not sure why you are donking again. Very few worse hands call and no better hand folds

Otr you’re blocking some bluffs he can have. A5s and 65s. Just muck it. If he showed you a bluff good for him
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Old 06-29-2018, 05:29 PM   #10
HomelessPizza
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Re: 55 defend 2/5nl

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tagyoureit View Post
I think calling pre is fine, they are 700 effective so you are getting good odds to set mine.
Reg opening in LP to 4x does not suggest a monster hand that we can set mine against. This is 3bet/fold pre.

Seems like if you are taking this line b/c V is passive and will check back overcards, then he is not the type of player you should be set mining to begin with.
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Old 06-29-2018, 06:23 PM   #11
oldsilver
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Re: 55 defend 2/5nl

Heh it’s fine and ty for the comments

I knew this hand was a train wreck when I played it

Are we only set mining AP though ? I didn’t like the cc cf option. And while leading is unusual, it threatens bet raise (I’m an unusually aggressive OMC) so V won’t raise light.

Obviously the standard line is call pre cc flop and consider getting stubborn on later streets if V checks back. I do know that, and for some unfsthomable reason decided to get experimental on this hand. Maybe I should just 3! more pre.
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Old 06-29-2018, 06:40 PM   #12
Playbig2000
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Re: 55 defend 2/5nl

regarding pre it's 18 dollars more to call and I usually would like to know I have 20:1 implied odds, which is like $350. Unless this is a guy who raises then never cbets/continues, the pre is an easy call.

However I'm basically calling to setmine, and as played there's nothing wrong with calling the flop and seeing what he does on the turn, but donking three times than not sure what to do when he raises the river just looks like fpss (fps spew).

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldsilver View Post
Maybe I should just 3! more pre.
that's not how you fix these issues you fix them by playing 55 for what it is which is a setmining hand like 98% of the time. Opening up your 3betting range from the blinds to include trash hands is only going to make things much worse.
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