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5/5 passive fish raised the river 5/5 passive fish raised the river

06-04-2021 , 09:22 PM
5/5 e600
Hero opens UTG w JTcc to 20.
UTG+1 passive fish calls.
HU
(50) flop 873shd
Hero bets 25. Quick call.
(100) turn Td
Hero tank checks. V snap checks back.
(100) Riv 8h
Hero tank bets 25. V raises to 75 in time. Hero?
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-04-2021 , 09:46 PM
This is 5/5, but I don't see how a "passive fish" raising 3x into you on the river, when top pair from the flop just made trips, isn't a snap fold.

Why the down bet on river? I would've thought 1/2 pot was more standard? I like everything else, though I'm eagerly awaiting hearing you should've bet 1/3 or checked flop. Is JTs a thin open, full ring, at this table?
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-04-2021 , 10:07 PM
i love river downbets live because quite often fish hung in there with some trash mid pair and it's all about that thin value. In this spot, I'd say when the fish bets you fold, especially when the board paired with exactly the kind of hand he'd have called flop with lol.
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-04-2021 , 10:34 PM
Shrug call getting 4:1. Boards misses a ton of an UTG opening range. Passive fish may or may not no that but I’m sticky.
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-04-2021 , 10:52 PM
I down bet riv to try and value target ace hi or a small under pair
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-04-2021 , 10:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nh,gg.
Is JTs a thin open, full ring, at this table?

Seems pretty automatic to me.

If you’re a beginner u could probably fold it tho
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-04-2021 , 11:06 PM
Against passive fish river is a fold.

I might check flop vs passive player, we can still bluff turn.

As played, turn should be a bet.
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-04-2021 , 11:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by monikrazy
Against passive fish river is a fold.

I might check flop vs passive player, we can still bluff turn.

As played, turn should be a bet.


Before the river action I think we have the best hand over 90% of the time...

So what value hands do u think villain has here??

I know Bayes etc but if he doesn’t need too many bluffs for us to justify a pot odds call here... idk

(I don’t see 2pairs, over pair, sets, straights, or even top pair snap checking back the turn. 89s or A8s are 2 hands I do think he would play this way tho)

Also, I think if I bet 2/3 pot or more on the riv and face a 3x raise I think the fold feels much better. But a block bet can have some effects on people and induce a spazz on different personas.
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-05-2021 , 07:33 AM
Passive fish do not raise river bets, no matter how small, with TP or worse. Either your read is bad or you're beat. Fold.
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-05-2021 , 09:23 AM
Stop tanking in small pots. Fold
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-05-2021 , 11:41 AM
Is this an auto c-bet for you? I feel like I'd rather c-bet if there's a club on board so I have more turn cards to barrel. Also the size seems a bit too large. I like $15 here.

Turn I'm going to bet again. Just gonna go for value vs a passive fish.

As played I love the small river sizing. I think you'll get called here by like 55 and any 7x etc. Hard to fold getting 4:1 and I'd prob level myself into thinking the small sizing induced a bluff raise haha. I'm calling river.
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-05-2021 , 03:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by OmahaDonk
Stop tanking in small pots. Fold


-1
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-05-2021 , 03:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by venice10
Passive fish do not raise river bets, no matter how small, with TP or worse. Either your read is bad or you're beat. Fold.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-05-2021 , 04:16 PM
Eh I'm cool just folding the river. We're beat a ton and a call is around break even. If he bluffed you then so be it. He gets to feel good about himself and hopefully that makes him open up more as the game goes on.

In game I can definitely see myself just paying it off tho
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-05-2021 , 09:22 PM
One of the biggest things that differentiate small from large winners in live FL is exploit folding in spots where someone just isn’t bluffing. Yes betting small with thin value and folding to a raise is exploitable, but do we really see bluffs 20%?


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5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-05-2021 , 09:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by OmahaDonk
Stop tanking in small pots. Fold
I don't understand why players tank in spots like this, and I really don't understand how after tanking a player would come to the conclusion that checking this turn card is best.
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-05-2021 , 10:04 PM
RESULTS:

4:1 and my range looks busted... idkzzzzz
Also v is repping an ultra thin value range and he has a ton of junk...

Hero calls it off >_<

V snap mucks.

Idk if my read was wrong or my sizing induced a spazz but pretty interesting either way.

He never showed a bluff for the rest of the night tho
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-05-2021 , 10:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hyperknit
RESULTS:

4:1 and my range looks busted... idkzzzzz
Also v is repping an ultra thin value range and he has a ton of junk...

Hero calls it off >_<

V snap mucks.

Idk if my read was wrong or my sizing induced a spazz but pretty interesting either way.

He never showed a bluff for the rest of the night tho
Ideas why the "passive fish" decided to try and bluff-raise the river?
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-05-2021 , 10:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JayKon
Ideas why the "passive fish" decided to try and bluff-raise the river?


Sizing is the only thing I can think
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-05-2021 , 11:25 PM
Yeah that’s hugely out of character. Makes me rethink how infrequently I’m calling fish river raises in live poker. At least when I do things like microbet


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5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-06-2021 , 02:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdr0317
Yeah that’s hugely out of character. Makes me rethink how infrequently I’m calling fish river raises in live poker. At least when I do things like microbet


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Funny thing is that passive fish are so passive that they might not even raise naked trips here.

If that’s the case hen he’s 100% bluffs lol
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-06-2021 , 02:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hyperknit
Funny thing is that passive fish are so passive that they might not even raise naked trips here.

If that’s the case hen he’s 100% bluffs lol

Yeah for sure. I’m just racking my brain to think of the last time I saw a live fish bluff raise the river. Maybe like a standard bad player might try it once in awhile if they’ve seen you fold in the past, but a straight up passive fish?


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5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-06-2021 , 02:32 AM
I suppose fish watch poker videos and think they can make a play from a 5/10 game in a 1/2. Still, I'm not calling often.
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-07-2021 , 03:44 AM
i actually love it when they bluff like this whether I called or fold. He probably thinks he made some hero play and got you off AA. Now they see you're opening as light as JTs utg which will go great for your image, especially when fishcake decides to randomly bluff you again on a board he thinks is good for his range but that you absolutely smash. I guarantee he makes this same play if a 9 peels. Probably one of those players who remembers his favorite scene from Rounders -- "I had nothing, but he raised and I decided I don't care about the money, I'm just going to out play the guy, I'm going to out play this guy, this hand"
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote
06-08-2021 , 09:57 PM
LOL at people calling JTs a lite open >_<
5/5 passive fish raised the river Quote

      
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