this one probably has more than one solution but i was pretty confused here as to how to proceed. I love my hand on the turn but it's pretty vulnerable

no reads both players have recently sat down and shouldn't have any reads on us either

Hero on the HJ covers

Mp1 (1700) opens to 35, hero calls with KJ

Button (1200) calls, blinds fold

pot 120, 3 players

K86

check, hero bets 70, both players call

pot 330, 3 players

J

check,

220

3bet pre.
On the flop, I would default to checking; if you bet, button calls, and the PFR raises, you're in an awful spot squeezed between the other two players. If you check, you cannot get squeezed on the flop. You also have a hand that doesn't need much protection (PFR unlikely to have a fd, btn likely to bet draws when checked to).
On the turn, we're gonna want to go big after getting two callers and ending up on a very dynamic board. $450 lets you get in stacks vs the PFR on the river, plus makes villain's fold a bunch of hands with equity, so that seems good

Like, Ranma said, 3b pre. BTN and BB are the only positions we should be overcalling in. I think the flop bet is fine though, and prefer that much more the checking. We get called by worse here all day. Don't see a point in letting FDs and SDs realize. Not really worried about a x/r from the PFR as the line is frequently used. All of his 88/66 TPGK wants to c bet. Not sure why he'd wanna x/r here.

As played, I think we're trying to target draws and TP here so I think I'd bet around $240. If we go closer to pot, or over, I think the only worse hand that calls us would be an oddly played AA/AK from MP.

yeah thanks for the advice but i dislike checking the flop, we basically never get re-raised by the opener

3bet pre is std i think but not 100% of the time, I think i probably go 75% 3b 25% flat 0%fold

i made a mistake by betting way too small, i think sizing this way up to pot or pot+ is absolutely fine. I made it 145, and both call so now the pot is pretty big and i have no idea what their outs are. I like betting huge on this turn, i actually don't think a standard sizing works that well due to RIO (not being able to determine what cards beat me)

then i went ahead and butchered the river

pot 775 3 players

4

check, hero?

I'm personally going a hair smaller than a PSB maybe $300. I think with 2 other players in we are stilling called by all the draws for this sizing. Sets up stacks for a jam on the river if a blank comes.

3 bet pre.

I'm not even going to comment on flop sizing because I think there are so many different sizes you can use.

I would go $300 ott to set up the river jam. People don't really fold top pair and there so many draws out there.

I don't think checking flop is ridiculous, but I would just go ahead and bet.

Turn is way too small, you're giving a decent price to draws and I think top pair is pretty inelastic to the size you chose and bigger.

At this SPR I would just shove river.

Pot turn

More turn, this river has to be a check now 3 handed.

This is not how you maximize your winrate. Holy MUBS.

Grunch:

Size up on the turn, anything from 3/4 pot to psb. Not having Kh is good, villain (specifically MP1) might have picked up bdfd with KhXh, QThh, etc. We want to charge his T9, JsXs, etc etc.

Too much of villains ranges have continues with Jh, size up/decide.

Edit: said UTG, misread that. Yea, 3b pre as some others have said but calling isn't bad either.

I said I’m checking not folding. 75s is a big part of ranges and there’s tons of air. Tf you wanna do bet into 2 pretty much well polarized ranges?

pre call or raise is ok
flop ok

turn I'm betting$275-$300

as played check/ calling river

here was the actual hands

V1 9Thh
V2 57ss

so i'm not even a favorite to the river so at least 80% of pot should be the best size

i got lucky on the river when villain only bet 130 with the nuts, unlucky that i got one of the only cards i have to call the river on, but good hand

? MP opened preflop so probably not much 75 there, especially after he x flop. BTN could certainly have it, but that's just 4 combos. For both of these guys, the parts of their ranges that have showdown value OTR (ie, not missed spades) are mostly just TP hands. Yeah, they could have sandbagged 88/66, but again that's not many combos to begin with, and even less considering they never put in a bet/raise themselves OTF&T. By checking river, we're letting BTN x back all of his Kx that will call a small amount if we bet ourselves. And for the times we actually are dominated, they'll raise and we have a fairly easy fold.

maybe 100% or just a complete overbet just to compensate for the hidden outs on the river, obv. if a spade comes we are just c/f but like the 4 of clubs and i'm calling whatever he bets

You mean 4 combos that they might not even have, and we're playing in games with players that very married to top pair?

I just view this spot quite differently.

You're looking for 3 streets from a Kx heavy range, Sixsevenoff is shoving I guess for the same reason?

This river isn't a check bc Imma scrrrrd and think they have 88/66/75, it's a check bc between the two of them they have those hands+air so often and far less Kx given action/scarcity. I mean this is why we can bet this turn, bc they're way too wide and just generally suck.

River is such a firm check given everything that I'm not even sure how else to explain it.

Again, you realize that by checking, IP might have an opportunity to stab all his hearts and 9 highs right?

Think about what your shove does to IP and how it impacts OOPs checking range. I mean, you need IP to have so many Kx AND call a shove while simultaneously ignoring the rest of his range that has 100/0? If IP is bad enough to overcall K5s pre, then call, call, then he also might be bad enough to bet river with it sometimes in which case you're making some money from a riv check sometimes as well.

Again, I just don't see what on Earth you guys are thinking. It isn't HU, it's 2b pot, we got guys calling and overcalling a board that connects w almost every SD and FDs that just turned more pair+SD equity....

I can't anymore. Go ahead and rip it in and get snapped off by 75s and then talk about how it's ok bc you weren't MUBSY and your shove is how you increase your wr.

The problem is that the population is more likely to x back 86 otr (and will pretty much never bet Kx) than it is to bluff a missed draw.

I'm fine with shoving and getting called by 75s on rare occasion or getting a busted draw to fold but then getting an 86 or Kx to call that would've checked back.

I don't care that much but how do we know this? If you were V1 it would have been a far cooler hand to explore.

I get that - I think the disconnect is that you're discounting the frequencies of these hands versus all the air. I know for SURE you are discounting 75s, QS did too, it's the OESD on the flop in a 2b pot that gets there.... 2 ranges that could have 75s bc we know nothing about them... but we do know that 75s absolutely can be played this way a lot, and that matters more --- and even OOP can have it and play it as a check... I certainly would if I got squirrely pre.

I just don't see it -- shoving remains insane to me.

you know i just remembered the end of the hand and i actually bet 130 on the river, villain said raise but only put in enough money for a call therefore it was just 130 back to me

what do you think of the micro blocking bet?

to some extent I also think they are forgetting these are $5-10 players and not $1-2