Flopped 2 pair v. aggro tard...I screwed up this hand?

Aggro tard playing something like 70/35 vpip/pfr in a live game and he's 3 betting a lot (his 3 bet range IP is pretty wide)...I have $2k, aggro tard has me covered...

I start hand with ATs, aggro 3 bets my MP $50 raise to $125, I flat and BB flats.

Flop Ah Tc 4c

I check, Aggro bets $250, BB folds, I flat.

Turn Jc

I check, Aggo bets $500

I think there's no chance he has flush and highly doubt he's got KQ, Aggro thinks for a very, very long time and then folds Ac4d face up, says he thinks I have the nuts...

I shipped thinking he might see this as an overbet/bluff with a draw or TP/TK type hand. How bad did I play this and how could I have gotten more value?

You could have made more if the worst looking card in the deck doesn't come down OTT. Frankly the line you took turned your hand into a bluff. This could have only worked out for more money if it ended up working as a merge. If he expects our polarized range to be nuts or nothing and tries to bluff catch with A4 here then we can profit. He's likely to continue with AcX drawing but otherwise I think he's only ever calling with a better hand here.

You turned your hand into Ac Xc and he believed you.

I wasn't playing TAG was playing a light LAG trying not to get too crazy with him OOP...does he always believe that our range is polarized as the nuts or air?

I would assume that a tard knows nothing about merging ranges to get value. I would believe his expectations of hands you show up there with that beat him do not include top two.

Fair enough, thank you...

Welcome.

As the hand played out if I'm concerned about getting max value from the hand I think after the fact we can judge that you pretty much did. If you flat there and the river bricks off he's never betting when checked to nor is he calling a shove (obviously). Flatting here gives a chance that a club falls off and he can easily barrel when checked to. The hand was over when he bet 500 and you decide to continue, regardless if you flat, min raise or crai.

Your HH is confusing...I'm assuming you CRAI on the turn?

In addition, you don't make clear if the Villain is only an aggro tard PF or it he is also overly aggro after the flop. If it is the latter, I don't like the turn c/r, since he only rarely has a better hand, and I'd rather let him bet again on the river.

Why didn't you c/r the flop? Any club, J, Q, or K is either an action killer or bad card for you. How could he think you have the nuts if he has the Ac?

why not just raise the flop on a board like that?

grunch

Yea i really dislike the shove. The biggest mistake people make when playing against the LAG is letting them win the information battle. Let this guy own himself the whole way. If you continue to just flat you give away the least amount of info and the LAG cannot adjust by making a correct fold. Obv this is a more variant route but it will also be the most profitable in the long run since the LAG range is way too wide.

^^^ 100% ^^^
The club is super scary for him when you check call the flop now you check shove. 😲
You basically allowed him to play his hand correctly.
You scooped the pot and that's great.
Just missed a max value opportunity against a spew tard who's likely to go on full monkey tilt.
(I understand the turn is scary for you as well) but if no flushes are in his range than its value town here.

I would checkraise flop.

However as played, stick to your line. Shoving the turn here is only getting a crying call from the straight or is getting called by a set/the flush at a minimum. The only other hand which calls you is one like he had with the nut flush redraw.

Call turn, let him bluff off on the river. Reevaluate if another club comes down.

Even checking then leading out really small on the river like you're putting in a blocker bet is more EV than shoving turn.

^^ scared money play and def. -ev^^
Don't let him set the price to draw if he is in fact behind.
Pressure is a must here or get out.
If you fold atleast you get to see showdown cards for your notes.

Scared money? No.

I think we're ahead in this spot and think that shoving gets folds a lot of the time. Nothing to do with being scared and everything to do with letting the villain spew off knowing we're good a big % of the time.

Also please write down and prove the EV.

EDIT: wait are you even talking to me? I basically reiterate what Superman1 said, which you agreed with, and now you're saying we must put pressure on him? Make your mind up.

Im confused bro, above you agree with me and here you are flaming for not applying pressure. which side are you on? or am i missing something?

+1

Stacking Chips please prove the EV of calling down vs getting it in. Interested to see the results as i'm pretty poor at maths.

Omg soooooo sorry
Not sure how I got this response in this thread --mixed em up,this was ment for another thread.
Please disregard.
I replied to like 4-5 in a row .
so sorry
I'm ******ed

^

Ha no worries, it does look like a very strange post.

Can anyone actually do the EV for calling down vs shoving in though? I'm literally terrible at maths, more a 'feel' player (which means bad.)

Instinct is very good to have on your side IMO .
As long as your using it along w table dynamics and history.
Ask BIP!! to run this for you he's a genius.
(Did you see his Ac?)
That is a game changer for surw