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5/10 AA in the SB 5/10 AA in the SB

11-22-2016 , 11:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 7weeks2days
UTG +2 had KK not QQ. Not sure if you misread or I am misunderstanding your post. I understand why they might but I thought they were flatting because of the solid reg on reg depth, less so because of the ep raise. It wouldve been nice if someone raised so I couldve seen the deep premium ep flats playout. I understand I shouldn't be auto flatting kings but for the first time I am playing a decent amount of 300 bb poker and I just dont have any experience and feel like I am missing out on a lot.

If everyone is 100bb deep, are you still flatting utg +2 w/KK?
It depends on how many 3b bluff's you're going to have from UTG+2 vs a UTG raise and UTG+1 call. Probably not many, and 3b'ing a linear range is incorrect here.
5/10 AA in the SB Quote
11-22-2016 , 11:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by papagavin
It depends on how many 3b bluff's you're going to have from UTG+2 vs a UTG raise and UTG+1 call. Probably not many, and 3b'ing a linear range is incorrect here.
Makes sense. From what positions in this situation would you be doing anything but flatting or is it too specific to table dynamics?Or if its vs all unknowns?

I know for me I am super unbalanced and would pretty much be 3! light almost never from anywhere but I guess there would be a better chance I would do it lp than ep. What do you think?
5/10 AA in the SB Quote
11-22-2016 , 11:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 7weeks2days
Makes sense. From what positions in this situation would you be doing anything but flatting or is it too specific to table dynamics?Or if its vs all unknowns?

I know for me I am super unbalanced and would pretty much be 3! light almost never from anywhere but I guess there would be a better chance I would do it lp than ep. What do you think?
It's entirely table dependent, having a balanced line is never going to be wrong but if it's not reg vs reg then it's much better to take an exploitative one and 3b with a somewhat or even extremely unbalanced range. It's too specific to answer really, but if your game has a bunch of regs who are actually good and adjust and likely mention interesting hands they see to each other then your range is going to become something you'll have to worry about.

I think that particular KK/KK/QQ hand just demonstrates that UTG+2 is aware of his range and is adjusting appropriately for the fact that he is rarely if ever 3b bluffing there.
5/10 AA in the SB Quote
11-22-2016 , 11:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 7weeks2days
UTG +2 had KK not QQ. Not sure if you misread or I am misunderstanding your post. I understand why they might but I thought they were flatting because of the solid reg on reg depth, less so because of the ep raise. It wouldve been nice if someone raised so I couldve seen the deep premium ep flats playout. I understand I shouldn't be auto flatting kings but for the first time I am playing a decent amount of 300 bb poker and I just dont have any experience and feel like I am missing out on a lot.

If everyone is 100bb deep, are you still flatting utg +2 w/KK?
Ava is right about the UTG1 range tending to be very strong but the primary reason UTG2 didn't raise KK has nothing to do with range dynamics and everything to do with the fact your BB (their UTG) is the spot.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Avaritia
In this hand, the idea that we are just as likely to induce a 4b by 3betting is silly. There's just no way that's true. When we 3b we give BB the one chance to not totally spew here with any two napkins. If we had a previous dynamic with him cold 4betting our 3bs like at any noticeable clip, maybe.

FWIW the idea that we should be flatting way less here and 3betting more of our continuing range (but simply just having a tighter range altogether) is correct. But it's correct because BB is going to squeeze here a ton. Which means we can flat AA and print da monies
I never suggested that youre as likely to induce BB to 4 bet via a 3 bet (compared to induce BB 3b by flatting), but only pointing out that he actually has more 4 bets than he should given his propensity for overplaying/not fully being in tune with opponents ranges. I also think it's worth noting that specifically with AA, hero blocks chunks of a euro (non-German) LAGs traditional 3b range which unavoidably moves him more toward overcalls when we flat and potentially more flats/bluffs when we 3 bet.
I'm sure there are spots where a flat might approach the EV of 3 betting, but just not when a super passive fun player 7x opens btn no matter who is in the BB.
5/10 AA in the SB Quote
11-23-2016 , 07:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amanaplan
Ava is right about the UTG1 range tending to be very strong but the primary reason UTG2 didn't raise KK has nothing to do with range dynamics and everything to do with the fact your BB (their UTG) is the spot.



I never suggested that youre as likely to induce BB to 4 bet via a 3 bet (compared to induce BB 3b by flatting), but only pointing out that he actually has more 4 bets than he should given his propensity for overplaying/not fully being in tune with opponents ranges. I also think it's worth noting that specifically with AA, hero blocks chunks of a euro (non-German) LAGs traditional 3b range which unavoidably moves him more toward overcalls when we flat and potentially more flats/bluffs when we 3 bet.
I'm sure there are spots where a flat might approach the EV of 3 betting, but just not when a super passive fun player 7x opens btn no matter who is in the BB.
I dont think Avarita was talking about your comments, i think he was referring to Papagavin. Also, we are playing 5/10, making villains button open was 3.5x.
5/10 AA in the SB Quote

      
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