1/2 Live

The table as a whole is very loose passive. Lots of 4+ way pots and limp-calling. Really there are only three people that even raise at all, including me.

V1 ($100): plays ok, better than average at the table because he is somewhat aggressive. He has been sucked out on a couple times recently. He seems very standard preflop, probably about a 20% raising range although I'm not sure if he is positionally aware or not.

V2 ($200)- doesn't bet EVER, only calls or folds and is calling a lot of preflop bets. He seems to be playing basically any two suited cards, any two face cards, any one gap unsuited cards, but has also limped with AA and AKs (with no strategic reasoning)

V3 ($200) -also doesn't ever bet but has a much tighter range preflop,

Hero($250) - probably has a TAG image but given the passivity of the table I'm not sure if anyone does a lot of thinking about that anyway, except V1 and a V4 behind me who seems solid.

V1 UTG raises to 10, V2 and V3 call, Hero has JJ in MP (no one has folded yet).

What is the 3! size?

I'm happy just winning the 30 but want to risk as little as possible because any of the 3 villains could have me crushed with how they play. I also obviously don't want a bloated 4 way (or more) pot with JJ.

10

38-65, Based on dead money I prob bet 46-52.

However, if the table is how you described limp-calling--- it's tough. You wanna get value from JJ against there calling ranges but you also wanna increase win % and easiness of decisions, higher win % and easiness of decision means bet more, getting value means you don't wanna scare away, so bet less. With 33$ dead in pot, 40$ certainly seems to small and inviting, too skimp on valuing too. 65$ is airmailing hand, BUT DOES THAT MATTER? Would opponents still call 55$+ to see a flop anyways, if yes then bet 55+$ but thing is #1 thing bad-unthinking-players react to is bet size, 'big bet means big hand, I fold'.

I prob in moment without all this time to think bet 52 with instinct: to bet enough to iso but get that call, extract value, and play easy post-flop. 52 would sound like me. I don't know why based on table description I would even think of betting 38, prob cause I know as a good play that's what I should be doing, but not in LLSNL.


Follow Up: You have good info on opponents, as long as you integrate that you should be able to play good post-flop.

not this.

either flat the 10 or make it 100 straight.

X2

Overall I don't like a 3bet here.

I don't see 100 straight. It commits us allin of course if V2 and/or V3 call plus there are players behind us yet to act. It's all player dependent. And if we get allin in this scenario were almost always behind.

We want a 3bet that lets us get away from the hand at some point when we hold JJ, I like ~40 if we do 3bet. We have position. Depends on how all other villains respond to 3bets. These tables always loosely call limps and raise but usually not 3 bets.

I just don't understand the reco to make it $100. v2 and v3 are way too trappy to commit stacks pf with JJ.

I also don't like a smooth call much either. Essentially that just turns the hand into a set-mine and it's too good for that.

I think about a pot size bet makes sense here. Maybe a bit more if you think that v1 calls (given his little stack). If you do get v2 or (especially) v3.... you'll have to play it fairly carefully post.

What does $100 get us that $50 doesn't?

$50 seems like a far better choice here imo.
So $10 or $50. I'd say $50.

Gets us all-in with V1 without pricing in V2 and V3 which seems fine.

$100 is terrible. Aside from short V1 we'll only get called by better.

$50 is fine I think. Maybe even $45 but I wouldn't go smaller. We can potentially get HU with V1 if he comes over the top too and everyone else folds.

I probably flat in game but I think 3! squeeze is better.

I prefer a flat.

V1 raised UTG to 10. That's usually a strong range.

Until we're sure he is not, we should assume he is, as most people who "Plays OK, and is very standard preflop" are.

V2 & V3 can easily come over any 3bet size and just get the rest of it in. So we're possibly left 4 ways all in, or we can keep it 4 ways by flatting 10 preflop with an upper medium pocket pair.

3x the original raise plus add on the calls, more if you are out of position. So 50.

this

it is very unlikely that they have better so they are going to fold. which is exactly what we want. they are going to also fold most of their QQ's and AK's. for 50, they are not going to do that.

There are guys behind Hero too. While it's unlikely they wake up with AA/KK it is possible. Far more likely that someone behind us or V1 has a monster than the 2 who just flatted and I can't avoid going broke against the 50BB stack.

Oddly in my game I think 50 folds AK. Don't know that QQ is folding for $100 either.