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3/5 Two bluffs and a possible value bet 3/5 Two bluffs and a possible value bet

07-14-2018 , 12:35 AM
Just came back from a 5 hour session and wanted to run some hands to get feedback on my play.

Hand 1) So I have been playing with the strategy of stealing the blinds pre-flop when I feel the players are weak. I would raise from the blinds if it is limped to me and I have decent holdings. I have been at the table for about an hour now and shown AA once and opened couple of hands without showdown. I have J9o in the SB. Two limpers and the action is on me. I make it $35. BB and one of the limpers call. Limper is a young asian player who is more fishy. A couple of hands back called two bets and checked on the river with a likely straight draw even when the possible flush hit the turn (his opponent showed only a pair so I am putting him on a straight draw). He doesn't make many aggressive moves so I am not worried about him. Pot is $100

Flop comes AQ2. I c-bet for $50. BB folds and Limper calls.

Turn is a 6. I bet $100 and he calls.

River is a 7. Now he could have an ace, queen or missed his flush draw. I don't have much showdown value so I bet $250. What do you make if this line? I can easily represent a lot of strong aces here.

Hand 2) A few hands later I have AT in UTG+1 and I open for $40. I get 4 callers. Pot is $200.

Flop comes 789r. Checked around. Two players had to act before me including villain who is the same limper from previous hand.

Turn us a J. Brings 2 diamonds. Checked to me and I bet $200. Everyone folds except for Villain who calls.

River is A. He snap checks. Should I bet here? It completes the flush. I am worried he might check back a small flush.

Hand 3) 2-3 hours into the session and I have KJ in middle position and I open for $45. I get 3 callers. Pot is $180.

Flop comes 942. I c-bet for $100 and Villain in button raises to $260. Villain has been tight. I haven't seen him being out of line and saw him 3-bet once before. There is already $540 in the pot and I only have to put $160 more. I make the call.

Turn is a A. Brings the second flush draw. I tank for a bit wanting to show I am contemplating here and check. He checks back. That caps his range is and I don't think he has a strong hand. Any set he is going to bet with those flush draws. In one of the earlier hands he made a huge bet on the turn when there was a flush and straight draw and showed his set.

River is 2. Pairs the board and completes the club flush. No showdown value and I felt I can easily represent the Ace. The 2 is a good card for me because I now have a better two pair. I admit I didn't do any other range analysis but I sensed weakness and I wanted to go with it. Pot is $700. I bet $400. What do you make of this line?
3/5 Two bluffs and a possible value bet Quote
07-14-2018 , 12:54 AM
Hand 1 is spewy on all streets except maybe the river. Fold preflop. J9o isn’t really a decent holding OOP, and you’re likely to get called by fishy limpets. Fold flop multiway with zero equity. Fold turn with zero equity. River if you don’t block spades this is a decent candidate to triple barrel even though you should never have gotten here.

If you properly construct your ranges you’ll find a more natural bluffs. It feels like you came up with a plan, but now your forcing things. Don’t make inflexible plans in poker.

Hand two the turn bet is way too big. You’re basically guaranteeing that you only get called by Tx+. Bet $75 or something. He would have to be a huge station to call the river with a worse hand. Just check and expect to rarely do better than chopping.

Hand three you block some hands you want him to fold and his line makes sense with Adxd which will probably find a call since your line is strange. If you have a read that he’ll raise the flop with 9x then go for it I guess. You don’t have to bet $400 though.

In the second two hands your preflop sizing is huge, but it seems like people in your games are extremely loose and call with tons of garbage, so it’s a good adjustment. If this is why you’re raising so large then it’s worth stressing how terrible hand 1 is.
3/5 Two bluffs and a possible value bet Quote
07-14-2018 , 01:08 AM
Thanks for the feedback. Yes I raise it to 40-45 because 25-35 gets too many callers. So I see how that violates the first hand. What do you mean by “construct a range to make natural bluffs” ?

I bet 200 because there were two loose players who call with drawing hands. And I did get the call from one of them. Would the raise make sense then or is it still too high?

Like I said I didn’t do much of a hand range analysis which is a weakness I need to correct. Why not bet 400 and really put the pressure ? A smaller bet looks more value-y?
3/5 Two bluffs and a possible value bet Quote
07-14-2018 , 01:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sabloid
Thanks for the feedback. Yes I raise it to 40-45 because 25-35 gets too many callers. So I see how that violates the first hand. What do you mean by “construct a range to make natural bluffs” ?
I mean that if you are more selective earlier in the hand, you will find it easier to pick hands to bluff with. For example, in hand one you are apparently raising with a lot of junky hands pre-flop. You are left with a lot of hands that connect poorly with the flop or don't connect at all. If you are more selective pre-flop you'll connect with the flop more often and have hands that "feel natural" to bluff with more often. For example, KdTd would be an excellent flop bluff since you have a far greater chance of improving than J9o.

Quote:
I bet 200 because there were two loose players who call with drawing hands. And I did get the call from one of them. Would the raise make sense then or is it still too high?
I still think $200 is too big. You want two pairs/maybe top pair to call. If they are just such big stations that they'll dump money into the pot when it's obvious you have Tx, then go ahead and bet large and don't bluff in these spots, but you don't need advice to beat these guys if they play so badly.

Quote:
Like I said I didn’t do much of a hand range analysis which is a weakness I need to correct. Why not bet 400 and really put the pressure ? A smaller bet looks more value-y?
His line is weird. His flop raise should be strong enough that an ace wouldn't scare him, but he's representing that he didn't like that card. He's likely either hoping the ace improved you and ready to raise you, or worried the ace improved you and hoping you check down. A small bet loses less when he raises with a good hand. If he has worse than an ace he'll probably fold to most bets unless it's really small or he's really bad. Also, betting very large represents a more polarized range where it's kind of hard for you to have nutted hands.

It seems like you play in an extremely juicy game. Good luck.

Last edited by browni3141; 07-14-2018 at 01:36 AM.
3/5 Two bluffs and a possible value bet Quote
07-14-2018 , 02:01 AM
Thanks! I usually have a tight range but recently opened up my stealing range because I could pick up the blinds easily. But I choose tables with known loose players so I should just continue with that tight range.

The other adjustment is of course just barrel with hands that have equity when called especially when out of position.

I think I have enough feedback to post results.

Hand 1) He called with A4o. He tanked for a bit and made the call.

Hand 2) I checked back. He shows 89hh for two pair. But I agree that I should have bet smaller. It was partly a scared sizing to avoid being called.

Hand 3) He tank called with JJ. Surprised he called. He said my check on the turn have it away. Which doesn’t make sense because he re-raised the flop. But I agree with you that my sizing made it look like I have a butter hand which is hard in that spot. But looks like he would have called with a smaller bet as well. Which is fine because I can make value bets against him.
3/5 Two bluffs and a possible value bet Quote
07-14-2018 , 05:01 PM
Seems like you have a really bad image at the table (which is understandable given your lines) so I would definitely tighten up and cut down on the cbet bluffing.

Use your image to go for bigger value with your value hands (eg hand #2 you should definitely be going for 3 streets).

Hand #3; OTF, again, given your image, you could be getting raised by overpairs or TPgk (no 2p combos in V range, you block fd's, sets probably not raising until turn since you love to spew). Really depends on how deep we are in deciding between a jam OTF.
3/5 Two bluffs and a possible value bet Quote
07-14-2018 , 08:07 PM
Hand 1 is incinerating money

Hand 2 I would check unless they are calling off hands like 98 here then bet small

Hand 3 bet turn if you’re gonna rep the ace
3/5 Two bluffs and a possible value bet Quote
07-14-2018 , 08:25 PM
Yeah in hand 3 I like a turn bet. You rep the A and still have equity going into the river if he calls. It sucks when he raises behind if he has a hand like A9/AK/AQ but if you get pushed off your equity you probably didn't have as much as you think you did anyway. You can definitely rep an A here easily if he has an overpair to the flop, since your A-high flush draw may have just paired up.
3/5 Two bluffs and a possible value bet Quote
07-14-2018 , 08:25 PM
@HomelessPizza I do check down on certain flops but yes need to tighten up my opening range. Jamming/re raising that flop is also an option but I need to constantly work on my range analysis.

@jbuz I think I could have bet turn if I had Thought that overpair are part of his range.
3/5 Two bluffs and a possible value bet Quote
07-14-2018 , 10:03 PM
Donking the turn is absolutely atrocious in hand three. His flop value range is not afraid of the ace (JJ is not a value raise). He is still completely uncapped.
3/5 Two bluffs and a possible value bet Quote
07-14-2018 , 10:55 PM
Yeah his JJ is not a value raise but more like an information/scared bet to win the hand right there.
3/5 Two bluffs and a possible value bet Quote
07-14-2018 , 11:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sabloid
@jbuz I think I could have bet turn if I had Thought that overpair are part of his range.
Sorry I misread the HH. I thought he just called flop and then you checked the Ace on turn.

Flop is actually interesting and it really depends what you think his flop raise range is. Given he raised flop and x back turn it seems more likely that he semi-bluffed flop with AX and checked back his equity on the turn. In this case I would just x/f river.

Flop is actually the interesting decision. You’re getting about 3.5:1 pot odds which is near direct. I probably make the call here but I think a tight fold is okay as well given your read on his tightness. He gifted you with a free river but there’s a good chance you didn’t want to see diamonds anyway.
3/5 Two bluffs and a possible value bet Quote
07-17-2018 , 04:54 PM
hand 1: meh, not sure what raising big pre does, and for the whole hand cbetting on flop is fine, the others are meh? on the river when you are betting, you are literally trying to fold his Ax hands

hand 2: not sure why so huge pre again, turn not sure where's the value from betting so huge, river, easy checkback, there's really no value in betting the river

hand 3: the only hand range i can see that can be vilain's turn check range is A3/A5dd hitting the ace and has showdown value, wants to go for a cheap showdown
villains flop raising range is sets n fd, hence when villain checks this turn, his range is probably never sets here, which is left with fd
hence i don't see how OP can bet the river, since your hand only loses to Axdd, other missed fd you beat, will most likely checkdown and you'll win with K high
if you really really want to bet, you only need to bet like 1/5-1/4 pot to prevent those missed fd from betting into you
3/5 Two bluffs and a possible value bet Quote
07-17-2018 , 10:50 PM
Thanks! Betting huge pre to win the blinds and also as a standard raise (from me) for the table.
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