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2/5nl @ Hustler, river decision with flush 2/5nl @ Hustler, river decision with flush

08-06-2013 , 04:35 AM
Table was an interesting bunch, pretty fun on the overall. Since this is the Hustler it was a 2-5 game with a max buyin of $300 (lame, but what are you going to do...guess play the 5-5nl game).

At the time of this hand I had about $550 in front of me, villain had bought in for $200 and was around $250 for this hand.

Villain: young Asian guy, seems nice, not arrogant, headphone and cap. Prob 24-27 years old. Definitely seems to care about the money. On the nittier side. Not one to bluff.

Me: 26yo white dude, friendly with other players at the table. Have been involved in some pretty entertaining hands up to this point and I'm sure V has noticed.

History with villain:

I raise AJs in MP, villain calls from the SB. If I recall correctly he had less than $200 to start, let's say $180.

Flop comes 8x5s2s, he checks, I bet 20, he raises to ~60, I shove, he calls with 99 and holds. Nbd, moving on to the hand...

Since the two aggro players on my right had folded, I raised 10-4 to 12 in middle position. Villain calls on the button.

Flop comes all clubs. I check, villain checks. Normally I'd bet here but for whatever reason, I didn't.

Turn is a blank. Bet 15, villain calls pretty quickly.

So close to 60 in the pot now on a blank river, I (purposely) bet $75. Villain shoves his ~250 stack quite quickly. Tank for a few minutes and fold, shows A7c.

Not looking for an ego stroke nor a pat on the back: hell I played the hand like somewhat of a monkey. I feel like if I bet 40-50 on the river, he's going to raise/shove and it's going to be much tougher to put him on a nutted hand.

Thoughts?
2/5nl @ Hustler, river decision with flush Quote
08-06-2013 , 05:19 AM
Don't include results from now on until later.

Definitely don't open with this. If you are going to, make sure the remaining ppl with position on you are OMCs or women. This is really bad if anyone to your left has a brain.

AP, I don't mind trying to c/r this flop. Against worse flushes and sets we get in more quickly then leading, getting called and having to lead future streets, we probably just get ai here.

I guess since the pot was so small we are deep enough to b/f the river? I don't know if b/f is correct here, but having the intent to b/f, the sizing is way off. If you're going to b/f don't over bet the pot. Over bet the bet with the intent (and hope that V will shove) of b/c'ing.
2/5nl @ Hustler, river decision with flush Quote
08-06-2013 , 06:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by eldiesel
Don't include results from now on until later.

Definitely don't open with this. If you are going to, make sure the remaining ppl with position on you are OMCs or women. This is really bad if anyone to your left has a brain.

AP, I don't mind trying to c/r this flop. Against worse flushes and sets we get in more quickly then leading, getting called and having to lead future streets, we probably just get ai here.

I guess since the pot was so small we are deep enough to b/f the river? I don't know if b/f is correct here, but having the intent to b/f, the sizing is way off. If you're going to b/f don't over bet the pot. Over bet the bet with the intent (and hope that V will shove) of b/c'ing.
pretty much the opposite imo. if we decide to b/fold for less than pot after showing weakness on previous streets, we might induce some spazz out and make some pretty weak fold. with this sizing, we are polarized and might easily level villain in some sort of hero call, whereas it´s unlikely he will spazz out with worse. river is well played imo;

pre and flop play are debatable, pre being usually a fold and flop with certain dynamics a c/calling situation imo, rarely a c/r, and the big majority of time a b/b/b line. you got kind of lucky that villain played the hand very badly imo.
2/5nl @ Hustler, river decision with flush Quote
08-06-2013 , 07:55 AM
Preflop and flop are the key points.

You don´t say why you raised pre, nor why you checked the flop.

I would think about those two things a lot more before worrying about anything else in the hand. It seems you may be making decisions without thinking at all.
2/5nl @ Hustler, river decision with flush Quote
08-06-2013 , 08:25 AM
These two hands are a great example of how u should think how your villain views u... If this nitty guy ships 99 on u, he views u as too loose... Time to tighten up and make him pay, not play T4

Sent from my SCH-I545 using 2+2 Forums
2/5nl @ Hustler, river decision with flush Quote
08-06-2013 , 10:29 AM
I don't understand the size of the raise pre, if you're just looking to take the blinds and already have a loose image, I'd think you need to go to at least $17, probably more like $25. Other than that, I think you did fine.
2/5nl @ Hustler, river decision with flush Quote
08-06-2013 , 02:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sauhund
pretty much the opposite imo. if we decide to b/fold for less than pot after showing weakness on previous streets, we might induce some spazz out and make some pretty weak fold. with this sizing, we are polarized and might easily level villain in some sort of hero call, whereas it´s unlikely he will spazz out with worse. river is well played imo;

pre and flop play are debatable, pre being usually a fold and flop with certain dynamics a c/calling situation imo, rarely a c/r, and the big majority of time a b/b/b line. you got kind of lucky that villain played the hand very badly imo.
You think this is the case vs this V though? It's a nit Asian, how often do we see nit Asians? I don't think we can ever induce bluffs from nits, I was thinking more in terms of just saving ourselves $ if he raises, b/c if he raises he'll have it.
2/5nl @ Hustler, river decision with flush Quote
08-06-2013 , 08:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by eldiesel
Don't include results from now on until later.

Definitely don't open with this. If you are going to, make sure the remaining ppl with position on you are OMCs or women. This is really bad if anyone to your left has a brain.

AP, I don't mind trying to c/r this flop. Against worse flushes and sets we get in more quickly then leading, getting called and having to lead future streets, we probably just get ai here.

I guess since the pot was so small we are deep enough to b/f the river? I don't know if b/f is correct here, but having the intent to b/f, the sizing is way off. If you're going to b/f don't over bet the pot. Over bet the bet with the intent (and hope that V will shove) of b/c'ing.
Thanks for the reply. When I checked I had the intention to c/r: was irked when it checked through. I guess I was in a somewhat passive state after taking some hits here and there.

I agreed I should have just bet something normal on the river. He's only raising with super strong hands (imo) and 75 into ~60 is just silly vs this type of opponent. When he shoves I think it is a relatively easy fold (but really, who likes to fold flopped flushes
2/5nl @ Hustler, river decision with flush Quote
08-06-2013 , 08:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sauhund
pretty much the opposite imo. if we decide to b/fold for less than pot after showing weakness on previous streets, we might induce some spazz out and make some pretty weak fold. with this sizing, we are polarized and might easily level villain in some sort of hero call, whereas it´s unlikely he will spazz out with worse. river is well played imo;

pre and flop play are debatable, pre being usually a fold and flop with certain dynamics a c/calling situation imo, rarely a c/r, and the big majority of time a b/b/b line. you got kind of lucky that villain played the hand very badly imo.
You make a decent point about betting less than pot OTR to induce spazz, but I really should have thought about this opponent's playstyle before betting 75. I just CANNOT see him raising worse. But then again, if I bet, let's say 45, I doubt he's shoving and maybe would just make it 90-130$ total, costing me more $ if I were to call.

As for your last point: yes, I agree. I can't believe the villain checked back the flop and JUST CALLED the turn.

Anywho, moving along...
2/5nl @ Hustler, river decision with flush Quote
08-06-2013 , 08:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by playertee
These two hands are a great example of how u should think how your villain views u... If this nitty guy ships 99 on u, he views u as too loose... Time to tighten up and make him pay, not play T4

Sent from my SCH-I545 using 2+2 Forums

Not an inaccurate statement.

But, it was suited, bro
2/5nl @ Hustler, river decision with flush Quote
08-06-2013 , 08:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ManikMarlin
I don't understand the size of the raise pre, if you're just looking to take the blinds and already have a loose image, I'd think you need to go to at least $17, probably more like $25. Other than that, I think you did fine.
Hm, not sure if he would flat $25 with A7c IP on a not-huge-stack. Prob would fold...
2/5nl @ Hustler, river decision with flush Quote

      
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