Open Side Menu Go to the Top
Register
2/5: When We Get Raised By LAG (But We Are LAG) on Turn With NFD 2/5: When We Get Raised By LAG (But We Are LAG) on Turn With NFD

12-30-2012 , 09:50 PM
Seeking any and all feedback regarding this hand.

Relevant stacks:
Hero (UTG +1): $825
Villain (BTN): $1100ish

Setting is fairly deep 2-5 game.

Hero opens to $20 with AhJh. It gets folded around to Villain on BTN, who calls. Blinds fold. Villain is a laggy, generally solid player; pretty sure he considers me an ultra-aggressive probably too spewy lag. We have a decent amount of history together.

Flop: 9h 6d 3h ($47)

Hero bets $25. Villain calls.

Turn: Qc ($97)

Hero bets $55. Villain snap-raises to $175.

Question 1: What's Hero's best option, considering Hero is confident that Villain thinks he is double barrelling here a large % of the time with a wide range?

Spoiler:
Hero elects to raise to $410, not leaving much behind. My rationale was that a reraise of this size would look stronger and more like a made hand than a shove, and given perceptions of one another I thought he could very well be raise-folding here.

Question 2: To what extent is this turn line a mistake?


Thanks in advance for any feedback. This hand has been bothering me for a couple of days, which is unusual.
2/5: When We Get Raised By LAG (But We Are LAG) on Turn With NFD Quote
12-30-2012 , 10:00 PM
Haven't read spoiler.

I would've bet bigger on both the flop and the turn. But especially the turn.

I probably would've went 30, 75. As played I think your line does induce a lot of raises on the turn with weakish hands and draws. I would hollywood, make a speech and jam.
2/5: When We Get Raised By LAG (But We Are LAG) on Turn With NFD Quote
12-30-2012 , 10:00 PM
It's hard to give an accurate read without more information, but I will say that if villain calls your raise on turn, he's unlikely to be folding on river.

I guess before I considered re-raising on turn, I would be aware that I am probably stacking off on turn and that I will have to give up river if he calls.

I'll be interested to see if anyone think that we should fire river if a blank falls.
2/5: When We Get Raised By LAG (But We Are LAG) on Turn With NFD Quote
12-30-2012 , 10:11 PM
This is an interesting raise on the turn. It may be AQ that floated you, or a set; maybe Q9. Were getting good odds to call and if he calls when we hit 50% of the time; Flatting the turn would be profitable.

Call and if we hit, bet $250.

Raise get it in is close, I need a really good read to speculate that I am getting him to fold 25%+ of the time.
2/5: When We Get Raised By LAG (But We Are LAG) on Turn With NFD Quote
12-30-2012 , 10:22 PM
This is a spot where I'd wish I had fewer chips. Jamming 600 (which is in effect what you're doing on the turn) seems like a poor risk/reward. Tough spot.

On the plus side, your user name is great
2/5: When We Get Raised By LAG (But We Are LAG) on Turn With NFD Quote
12-30-2012 , 11:08 PM
like the flop bet, although i would've bet $35-$40. ott, i would probably just check, even though it gives up control and looks weak, but that can be used to our advantage if we make the flush otr. so when he bets ott, i would call, as you have 7 for sure outs, and may have 15. plus, this line could look like you have a pair of 7's or 8's that is scared of the 9. and if you make your flush otr, i would definitely check, let him bet, and then raise it.

not sure about the turn re-raise but then again i think this is very read dependent. on the surface it appears to commit your entire stack with only one card to come if he flats the turn and you feel compelled to fire the river if you miss. i can understand the thinking, though, as re-raising him ott would fold out a lot of one pair hands that are winning, which is good, but gives him most or all of your stack when he has two pair or a set, which is not so good.
2/5: When We Get Raised By LAG (But We Are LAG) on Turn With NFD Quote
12-30-2012 , 11:17 PM
I think this is a fold. You dont really know if you have implied odds because you dont know if a bare Q is going to call a big river bet if a heart falls on the river.

I think you can find a better spot.
2/5: When We Get Raised By LAG (But We Are LAG) on Turn With NFD Quote
12-30-2012 , 11:36 PM
turn raise should be larger. thinking lags are going to interpret smaller bets as weakness and pounce all over them. would you really be raising this amount with say KKs or AAs or even AQ? probably not.

your getting a decent price to call. with 9 clear outs and possibly 12 if the A will also make the best hand, you have about a little more than 20% equity. your getting 2.7 on a call, so you would have to pick up at the minimum 150 otr when you hit to make it a profitable call. pot will be about 450 so it seems very likely who have the implied odds to call.

however, if you shove, which i think is the only move if you raise, you need him to fold roughly 55% of the time. this depends on your reads on him as a player. if he is capable of raising light, or you think your smaller raises induced a raise with a semi weak hand, shoving could also be very profitable.
2/5: When We Get Raised By LAG (But We Are LAG) on Turn With NFD Quote
12-31-2012 , 01:54 PM
Thanks for the thoughtful analyses, all -- obviously a tough spot given the diversity of responses, which makes me feel a little better about the odd line that I took.
2/5: When We Get Raised By LAG (But We Are LAG) on Turn With NFD Quote
01-01-2013 , 03:24 PM
lol what he sees us as a very spewey maniac and you wanna raise and leave a really awkward amount for river? if you wanna raise you kinda need to jam because the river will be super hard to play out of position and it's unlikely he folds q9 or something.

just call. if we hit i would just throw out a few hundred dollar chips.
2/5: When We Get Raised By LAG (But We Are LAG) on Turn With NFD Quote

      
m