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2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! 2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets!

07-26-2017 , 11:43 AM
Villain is an old OLD school player. To give you an idea: I played with him.at the WYNN back in 2009.

I used to think he was good but back then the player pool was,pretty weak and i recognize his mistakes better now. He opens to 7x sometimes, his pre flop sizing corresponds exactly to his hand strength, and he NEVER folds to 3 bets pre.

Oh i already said that.

He is stuck 2bi right now because he raised to 20 in LP, got 3bet to 100 by BB, flop 2s5hTs. BB checks he bets 50, bb calls, turn 3d, bb check, he bets 250, bb shoves for 700 effective on top, he calls, BB shows AKss and spikes river

Ok so that seems WP by villain. This is why i thought he was good at some point.

But, he bought in for 500 after that hand, called another 100 reraise and folded the flop

Down to 400 and he calls another 3b for 100 and folds flop

Now that i think about it i cant remember the last time he didnt call a 3b

2 hands:

6handed.

A rec fish (350) who is stuck big and plays terrible (felted with JJ on AK high board post flop, folded a set getting direct odds on a flush board) posts straddle.

Villain has 1k now after losing the rest of the 500

Villian opens button to 45, which he has done on 3 consecutive orbits

Folds to hero (covers) on sb A2

Hand 2

6 handed

Hero (covers table) opens to 15 in UTG1 with QQ, one flat, villain (1k) makes it 130 from sb

Last edited by JB Clark; 07-26-2017 at 11:49 AM.
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-26-2017 , 12:01 PM
Hand 1: fold

Hand 2: You've played with him a bunch. Does he ever do this light? What does he do with JJ and AK? You said his raising size corresponds to hand strength. How so?
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-26-2017 , 12:04 PM
H1: fold. Don't bother. Maybe this deep you can flat if he's really easy to play against post, but I don't like it, esp with another player still in the hand who is short.

H2: Gross. See questions above. You mentioned that he never folds to 3bets, but how often does he 3bet? How often this big? If he rarely 3bets and his bet sizes correlate to hand strength, just fold.
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-26-2017 , 12:08 PM
Its 6 handed and we are never folding for 1bi with QQ regardless of opp if that helps.

This is a 200bb game so plays more like 5/10

But yeah, never AA/KK based upon my reads
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-26-2017 , 12:14 PM
Then by all means raise/gii pre while you are ahead. If he folds (unlikely) it's still a pretty good pot.
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-26-2017 , 12:17 PM
Hand 3

6handed

Same rec fish on straddle (400) after the A2 hand.

Villain (1k) raises 45 from CO

Young kid (700) decent not great reg flats btn

Hero (covers) 66 on BB
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-26-2017 , 12:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Javanewt
Then by all means raise/gii pre while you are ahead. If he folds (unlikely) it's still a pretty good pot.
Size?
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-26-2017 , 12:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JB Clark
Its 6 handed and we are never folding for 1bi with QQ regardless of opp if that helps.

This is a 200bb game so plays more like 5/10

But yeah, never AA/KK based upon my reads
Never folding queens for 200 big blinds pre regardless of the opponent?

This logic is highly flawed.
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-26-2017 , 12:31 PM
Hand 1 fold
Hand 2 flat. gii for 200bb is superspewy. you said his raise size correlates with hand strenght, you said he calls all 3bets. you never said he´s 3betting too wide and especially you never said he stacks off way too wide preflop 200bb deep.
Hand 3 flat
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-26-2017 , 12:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sauhund
Hand 2 flat. gii for 200bb is superspewy. you said his raise size correlates with hand strenght, you said he calls all 3bets. you never said he´s 3betting too wide and especially you never said he stacks off way too wide preflop 200bb deep.
He also said V never has AA/KK here, and it's essentially 100bb w/ the straddle.
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-26-2017 , 12:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JB Clark
Size?
Commit him. 3X is fine.
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-26-2017 , 01:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Javanewt
He also said V never has AA/KK here, and it's essentially 100bb w/ the straddle.
Hero openraised to 15, I don´t think there is a straddle.

I don´t know why villain can never have AA/KK here.
I don´t see were it is stated that villain will gii pre with worse than QQ for 200bb deep.
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-26-2017 , 01:09 PM
H3: If fish does not raise light, flat is fine.
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-26-2017 , 01:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sauhund
Hero openraised to 15, I don´t think there is a straddle.

I don´t know why villain can never have AA/KK here.
I don´t see were it is stated that villain will gii pre with worse than QQ for 200bb deep.
Sorry, other hands had straddles. Not sure why H opened so small? Weird. I can't see a flop for $15 in my 1/3 game.

H states V never has AA/KK, and that's what we have to go by so we go by it. If H is wrong, so be it, but we can't make that call.
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-26-2017 , 01:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Javanewt
Sorry, other hands had straddles. Not sure why H opened so small? Weird. I can't see a flop for $15 in my 1/3 game.

H states V never has AA/KK, and that's what we have to go by so we go by it. If H is wrong, so be it, but we can't make that call.
if this is another soulread, villain has worse 100% and never folds, I don´t see where the question is.
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-26-2017 , 01:14 PM
No straddle in hand 2. Hand 2 isnt that hard but we believe v never has AA/KK. He would def raise LESS. There is a negative correlation at the top of his 3b range. He plays all the time and wont be a drooler with a better pair

Its not a question of if but how much. Obv this is the least interesting hand since im always stacking off pre
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-26-2017 , 09:51 PM
Hand 1: Can't get odds and he won't fold to a bluff raise so just fold.
Hand 2: Once you 4 bet you will never be folding and his bet inflates the pot so there is no reason to go big. I like $300 to setup a flop bet/turn shove. $250 also works but is suspiciously small if villain has any sense.
Hand 3: Easy flat. Either you hit the flop or you are done with the hand.
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-27-2017 , 01:23 AM
Hand 1: fold, not worth it. Lots of better spots.

Hand 2: $400-425, calling AI.
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-27-2017 , 01:26 AM
I have folded QQ to a 3bet, what is the big deal? I usually don't, but vs some people that very rarely 3bet I do.
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-27-2017 , 01:45 AM
Im super confused by this post.

hand 1: V never folds to 3 bets, and a huge bet means a huge hand, and youre considering a polarized range against his biggest bet size? Value bet him with 3 bets, i feel like thats obvious.

Hand 2: so his bet sizing directly relates to his hand size, but now he makes it $130 pre and...he cant possibly have AA KK? I mean, thats contradictory, but if its he latter, this shouldnt even be a post, he never folds and never has better so you reraise...
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-27-2017 , 12:29 PM
His sizing correlates to hand strength, meaning he over raises AK AQ.

Hand 2 is hilarious because i made it 500 straight. The dealer figured that would win the hand and somehow flashed an Ace. V said he would have called had he not seen the ace. Tank mucks AQ face up. Asks me if i had 67s lol.

Hand 1 i folded but looking back i dont think flat is too bad.

Hand 3 i think i can 3bet but have to make it huge
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-27-2017 , 12:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JB Clark
Hand 1 i folded but looking back i dont think flat is too bad.
3bet pre
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-27-2017 , 03:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Playbig2000
3bet pre
because?
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-27-2017 , 03:14 PM
I feel that flatting hand 1 is fine. I wanted to 3b but thats when it hit me that v will never fold pre and i have a good hand to invite the shortie to play. I wish i had that one back and seen a flop. But agree fold is fine

Hand 2 i just got greedy, should have raised smaller

Hand 3 there is such a big overlay, already 100 there and the flatter prob folds a ton if i make it big enough. Im still torn between something stupid like 250 or flatting
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote
07-27-2017 , 03:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sauhund
because?
because we have a habitual button raiser who should be wide enough for us to 3bet light. I'm not even trying to fold him out preflop, I make a lot more money when he flats pre, flats the flop, then folds the turn.

I would prob 3bet to 105, nothing too crazy and I will expect him to flat. I took initiative away from him, I have a skill advantage over him, and since I 3bet I don't need a card advantage or position. It's on him to fish for a good flop to continue. I didn't see anything in his description that he can bluff or get creative.

If it was a tighter player I would just fold pre. I'm never flatting pre heads up with a junk hand OOP.
2/5 Villain NEVER folds to 3bets! Quote

      
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