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2/5: Stealing from LP 2/5: Stealing from LP

04-27-2016 , 08:05 AM
I think the turn bet is where I went wrong, but I'm trying not to be results-oriented about it because it set up the river shove.

V went into the tank and tried to figure out what I had. When he finally settled on either aces or kings, I knew I was getting called. I just had to sit there and not move long enough for him to talk himself into it. Through his table talk in the tank I also deduced he held AxQ.

He called after about 2 minutes and he was visibly stunned at what I held in my hand. He got up after a few minutes and came back from the cage with a $1,300 add-on and steamed away about $800 of it before quitting.

I really think that if I had bet $250 he would have folded. The overbet shove confused him and he leveled himself into calling.
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04-27-2016 , 08:44 AM
He wasn't folding for $250. Glad he called the all-in. I hope you got a lot of that $800!
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04-27-2016 , 08:52 AM
Not enough of it.
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04-27-2016 , 10:53 AM
Hero's hand is good here, but you have to check river to induce. (I know, I know.. betting the whole way with bottom pair, getting there with trips and checking.. lol)

If he's got the draw, he will bluff. If he's got an ace and thinks you're on the draw or he loves his kicker, he'll bet anyway.

Last edited by Hardball47; 04-27-2016 at 10:59 AM.
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04-27-2016 , 11:32 AM
Pretty sure he checks behind with his hand, which is an absolute disaster.
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04-27-2016 , 11:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Koko the munkey
Pretty sure he checks behind with his hand, which is an absolute disaster.
Agree. Never checking river.
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04-27-2016 , 11:51 AM
pretty good until the river.

I might have either checked the flop or the turn for pot control.

the river bet is very poor.

you are trying to get him to call you down light, but as you have said, you have a very good table image, so why would he ever call you down light?

OTR, either put out a weak blocker bet for like 80, and hope that he comes over the top with his missed draw, or else check it to him and let him bluff at it.
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04-27-2016 , 11:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Koko the munkey
Pretty sure he checks behind with his hand, which is an absolute disaster.
Why is that an absolute disaster? You think he's calling you down with ace-poo only to see a free showdown?
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04-27-2016 , 12:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Koko the munkey
I think the turn bet is where I went wrong, but I'm trying not to be results-oriented about it because it set up the river shove.

V went into the tank and tried to figure out what I had. When he finally settled on either aces or kings, I knew I was getting called. I just had to sit there and not move long enough for him to talk himself into it. Through his table talk in the tank I also deduced he held AxQ.

He called after about 2 minutes and he was visibly stunned at what I held in my hand. He got up after a few minutes and came back from the cage with a $1,300 add-on and steamed away about $800 of it before quitting.

I really think that if I had bet $250 he would have folded. The overbet shove confused him and he leveled himself into calling.

so he either put you on the nut boat, or KK with the missed nut flush draw. and since he held an ace blocker, he went with the KK hand.

I still don't like the river play. it only worked because he had a relatively good bluff catching hand. but in most cases, he is only going to be holding a diamond draw with a gutter, or something like that, that does not have any showdown value. So most of the time, this play is not going to work unless you are crushed, and you are just value owning yourself.

but as far as establishing a LAG image and setting up future hands to get called down light, kudos. when you turn up pieces of trash like that that are winners, it puts at least half of the table on tilt. then, you get to sit back and just value the eff out of your big hands.

just don't go card dead when you have the table primed up for a huge run like this.
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04-27-2016 , 12:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PFunkaliscious
so he either put you on the nut boat, or KK with the missed nut flush draw.
Cannot we have rather KdX that completely missed? It is much better than KdKx for this line, KdKx is mandatory x/c otf.
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04-27-2016 , 01:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shamway99
Cannot we have rather KdX that completely missed? It is much better than KdKx for this line, KdKx is mandatory x/c otf.
read what I highlighted. the OP said V put him on this range. not what I said.
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04-27-2016 , 01:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PFunkaliscious
just don't go card dead when you have the table primed up for a huge run like this.
Any pointers on this part?

I agree with you for the most part, but my reads on him in the OP were not after-the-fact-confirmations. I understand that it's a difficult claim to take at face value, but those were my actual thought processes at the time. I accepted that there was a decent chance that my read was wrong, but I decided to go with it and play the hand as if he had exactly what I thought he had. Maybe it's variance, but I've had good results relying on timing tells from low stakes opponents, even more so from good players as their habits have become ingrained.

I also agree that the turn bet was spew, especially when we don't know what would have happened on the river had I not binked and instead stuck to the $250 bet on non- rivers. If he was calling anyway, then my line against this V sucks.
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04-27-2016 , 02:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Koko the munkey
Any pointers on this part?

I agree with you for the most part, but my reads on him in the OP were not after-the-fact-confirmations. I understand that it's a difficult claim to take at face value, but those were my actual thought processes at the time. I accepted that there was a decent chance that my read was wrong, but I decided to go with it and play the hand as if he had exactly what I thought he had. Maybe it's variance, but I've had good results relying on timing tells from low stakes opponents, even more so from good players as their habits have become ingrained.

I also agree that the turn bet was spew, especially when we don't know what would have happened on the river had I not binked and instead stuck to the $250 bet on non- rivers. If he was calling anyway, then my line against this V sucks.
I mean if you can specifically put V on AxK or AxQ, that is a really good bet on the river, because he is always going to check behind, and you need to go for max value. With the stack sizes that you had, shoving was a very good number.

If there is anything that this hand should be an example of, is hand reading of your V. those quick calls, like you said, are always indicative of a strong draw that does not feel the need to semibluff when they have position.

If V was out of position, there is good chance that he would have either CRed the flop or turn. or lead out on the turn. which makes our hand almost completely unplayable.
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