Open Side Menu Go to the Top
Register
2/5 really interesting turn spot 2/5 really interesting turn spot

04-13-2013 , 11:40 PM
2/5.

Preflop: Folded to hero in CO, hero makes it $25 with Jh7d looking to iso SB (passive nit; stack him if we hit miracle flop or likely take the flop down with a cbet depending on flop) or BB (loose aggro). Button calls, BB calls. Button sat down at the table only a round ago, but he did play and win a big pot when he played a draw loosely and hit (don't remember if he was aggressive with it or not, I just biased my view of his playstyle towards loose/draw chaser after that hand).

Flop: 7s Jd Kh.

BB checks, hero bets $45, button calls after thinking a little bit, BB folds.

Turn: Qh. Pot is ~165. eff stacks $530.

Hero?
2/5 really interesting turn spot Quote
04-14-2013 , 12:18 AM
Fold pre. /thread
2/5 really interesting turn spot Quote
04-14-2013 , 12:19 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wj94
Fold pre. /thread
yeah.
2/5 really interesting turn spot Quote
04-14-2013 , 12:29 AM
I should mention that my preflop raises are almost never light, I hadn't played a hand in over a round, and both blinds are likely to have observed this.

Anyway, any non-nits out there? The hand gets very interesting, I just want to see what you guys think is good bet sizing here (or even a check??).
2/5 really interesting turn spot Quote
04-14-2013 , 12:29 AM
As played: take a pot control line. You got incredibly lucky to hit this flop against a nit who has position on you with a hand that has great reverse-implied odds. You don't want to end up stacking off here to KQ.

For what it's worth you are not going to consistently do well at 2/5 making plays like that against those types of opponents behind you. This is only acceptable if all three players behind the CO are either absolute donkeys or extremely tight and passive. I don't know how deep you would have to be for this to even be considered a value raise but slightly over 100bb is not it. Fold that junk pre man.
2/5 really interesting turn spot Quote
04-14-2013 , 12:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by darkestfog
I should mention that my preflop raises are almost never light, I hadn't played a hand in over a round, and both blinds are likely to have observed this.

Anyway, any non-nits out there? The hand gets very interesting, I just want to see what you guys think is good bet sizing here (or even a check??).
Folding total garbage RIO hands pre does not equal nitty.
2/5 really interesting turn spot Quote
04-14-2013 , 12:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by minimals
As played: take a pot control line. You got incredibly lucky to hit this flop against a nit who has position on you with a hand that has great reverse-implied odds. You don't want to end up stacking off here to KQ.

For what it's worth you are not going to consistently do well at 2/5 making plays like that against those types of opponents behind you. This is only acceptable if all three players behind the CO are either absolute donkeys or extremely tight and passive. I don't know how deep you would have to be for this to even be considered a value raise but slightly over 100bb is not it. Fold that junk pre man.
That is fair, I shouldn't let boredom get the best of me. I do think, though, that occasionally winning a big pot after raising pre flop with a hand like J7o will get you better action when you fall back to standard tight preflop play. However, it's not the best hand to do this with, since even in this case villain could put me on KJ, so its strength isn't all that disguised, and making a straight not only loses to but looks like QJ when I show strength.
2/5 really interesting turn spot Quote
04-14-2013 , 12:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by darkestfog
That is fair, I shouldn't let boredom get the best of me. I do think, though, that occasionally winning a big pot after raising pre flop with a hand like J7o will get you better action when you fall back to standard tight preflop play. However, it's not the best hand to do this with, since even in this case villain could put me on KJ, so its strength isn't all that disguised, and making a straight not only loses to but looks like QJ when I show strength.
Correct. Even suited the hand doesn't really end up valuable unless it's a total cooler or spew by the villain. K5s are the kind of speculative hands LAGs make money on. They can only win by playing the higher end of the hands that cooler. That's a bad turn for you just get this hand to showdown, win, and add to your already loose image.
2/5 really interesting turn spot Quote
04-14-2013 , 12:58 AM
Turn action:

Check or bet both seem like options here, since hands that we beat and hands that beat us can all viably call or raise. It's hard to imagine any hand calling the flop folding to a medium-sized bet, unless it was a small pocket pair that just didn't believe the c bet, which is only calling a river bit if they hit one of their outs.

Hero decides to bet $100.

Villain thinks for a little bit, stacks up chips for a call, then tanks for about 2 minutes and makes it $300.

Hero?
2/5 really interesting turn spot Quote
04-14-2013 , 01:22 AM
I think you're in a really bad spot now against a nit. Unless this dude has some tendencies to float or make plays at people who lead oop you have to fold this. If he's creative and you can actually find some hands that he would be making plays at you with (will be barrel k10?) then shove.
2/5 really interesting turn spot Quote
04-14-2013 , 01:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by minimals
I think you're in a really bad spot now against a nit. Unless this dude has some tendencies to float or make plays at people who lead oop you have to fold this. If he's creative and you can actually find some hands that he would be making plays at you with (will be barrel k10?) then shove.
He's not a nit from what I knew. He only sat down a round ago and I saw him win a big pot chasing what looked like a negative-EV draw.

Nit villian is a snap fold obviously.
2/5 really interesting turn spot Quote
04-14-2013 , 01:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by darkestfog
He's not a nit from what I knew. He only sat down a round ago and I saw him win a big pot chasing what looked like a negative-EV draw.

Nit villian is a snap fold obviously.
ah my b the sb was the nit in the hand. Well, he then has a lot of combo draws and top pair hands here in his range too. I say you started this hand taking a line that you knew could put you in some high variance situations. This is one of them. I you believe this dude is stacking off with AA, top pair or a combo draw - then get the chips in now.
2/5 really interesting turn spot Quote

      
m