Disagree, come on man.

It’s not like any of us could be results oriented or anything..

Maybe he thought he needed to go two streets to get the job done but very few people start running a bluff with a 1/4 turn sizing multi-way.

Especially a loose passive that limped +1 pre. I’m pretty sure we’re beating him over 90% of the time in this spot with QJ. Obviously, we have other players to worry about as well but that can also be an argument in favor if raising.

ETA: I see that you also advocated for a raise.

Treat this sizing as a check ido

I said I would go for two streets if the turn was x to me. That's the exact opposite of x'ing back turn.

I really don't see the point of raising the turn. I guess I can see an argument for making a super small raise, but it's pretty hard to get action from hands we're ahead of. Plus versus that sizing, we open the door to get additional value from the blinds if we just call.

So if V bet $30 or 1/8 pot you’d still treat it the same as a $130 bet? And differently than a check?

V is literally manipulating the pot size and you’re letting him lol.

ABC poker ftw lullz. No need to think

Then you can cbet with air 5 way and take it down like always cuz it's hard to make a hand better than top pair.

I never understand that logic. Betting flop is not a bluff nor is it too thin. You can't just give a free turn to 4 opponents here.

So you are betting flop? Yikes, as a mentioned prior, KJ is the bottom of my betting range here.

67o that’s not a thing.

(Listing a draw as the bottom of your betting range)

As it’s not for value and it’s your highest EV bluff

Idgaf I'm not bluffing 5 ways. Betting KJ on this board is not a bluff.

Yes it is. Never heard of a semi-bluff?

What are you hoping to accomplish by betting KJ 5 ways?

I already mentioned this; worse Qx, and Tx. I don't think I mentioned it, but AK, AJ, KJ, and J9, too.

You're trying to sound so smart, but you are being ridiculous.

I’m being ridiculous and trying to sound so smart by telling you that you’re bluffing by betting K high 5 ways?

Can’t wait to hear you be like “oops meant KQ obv” without an apology.

I can’t read your mind. You kept saying KJ. Incredible.

Learn to read and write before you act like an ******

Yeah I meant KQ, but it was pretty clear that's what I meant

If you read my responses instead of attacking me for no reason, it was pretty clear I was going off of what YOU said.

Ridiculous. I’m just trying to help you. If you don’t want to listen that’s fine. By no means am I trying to sound smart.

5 ways with L/C and blind cold-call ranges on a QT4 board? No, I really don't think it is.

And as I said below, while there are some worse hands that can call, there are enough better ones that will also flat that you'll just be bloating the pot with a meh hand and no real idea where you are.

What hands are you so worried about giving a free card to? A couple of OESDs are out there, of course, but we'd have to bet pretty big to deny them odds and we'd be value cutting the hell out of ourselves against the KQs of the world, etc.

It always makes me laugh on here when there’s a spot that can be played fine multiple ways without it making a huge difference, but people argue that their way is the only way.
This flop spot really is completely fine to mix it up, and as long as you aren’t betting big, I don’t really see a mistake. There isn’t always a definitive correct answer people.

Same deal wrt turn spot against these specific V’s imo.
River is a snap call AP though. That is the only clear cut decision imo.

I couldn't agree more, these are pretty marginal spots and it's not a big mistake either way

i do lean towards the small cbet on the flop though, the hand won't be that hard to play if you cbet small , whereas if you xback you will be in a strange spot ott vs the field, if you get x/r'd or x/c'd and led into ott then you could just let it go depending on the sizing

after looking at board ott, there is 2 spades out there and multiple flush combos that V could be leading with so i don't mind a raise there for some protection and value from weaker pairs, I think hero will be good there a lot; calling is fine as well

Whoa 70 pre? Shouldn't the calling inelasticity of our opps make bloating the pot for the sake of bloating the pot a bad idea with a lowly QJ in the HJ in a loose live game? Two other comments say 50 was too much which also seems silly. You've essentially got 7 players left to act after you raise and betting 35 often coaxes out all the callers. Basically I like pf size.

With this hand, potentially. Although QJs flops well. I don’t expect us to go 5 ways either very frequently with a $70 sizing in almost any reasonable game, regardless of how stationy everyone is. I’m going the same size with every hand in my raising range though.

Although there’s less dead money out there than I initially thought for some reason.

Basically, if their calling ranges are inelastic we should undeniably be sizing up. We can’t look at this as bloating the pot since we’ll have QQ-AA,AK etc. as well and it’s a super +EV spot vs a couple loose passives for example. Getting 4 callers otoh can get us into some gross spots non shallow which will happen more often with a $50 sizing.

We got a really favorable runout here.

People are crazy. 6x+2x for each limper = $60 plus $10 with players behind us seems reasonable. It’s the equivalent of going $25-30 in 1/2 over 3 call happy limpers.

Flop is generally a check for me here. It makes sense to have some hands to check the flop and continue on the turn with, and top pair with the weakest kicker (that you'd play this way pre-flop) is as good a candidate as any.

My coach said checking flop is fine, but that he'd just shove the flop. It makes sense with how sticky people are.

Uhh... nearly 2.5x shove the flop into 4 ranges?
You realize you don’t want people to be sticky if you’re doing this, right?
Anything that calls you will beat you.
A sticky call from KQ here is a disaster.

Often the best results occur as a result of taking note of how to exploit the different V’s involved in a hand. Their position and their main weaknesses. Sometimes this is even easier to do multi-way with a medium strength hand.

And while it’s important to not be results oriented, the best exploits usually produce the best results do it’s a chicken/egg situation argument.

Mostly grunch: People will call $30 in a 1/2 game because 30 dollars is 30 dollars, and honestly even this is actually debatable. This would not be considered a standard betsize and even though your opponents might be tourists they have probably been conditioned to something a little more sane. They aint callin 70 though even if it's 2/5. Wanting to go HU with QJs? Shove flop? What are you guys even trying to accomplish? Whatever happened to playing poker here? You're IP vs a bunch of donks with a hand that flops great and just did. Play normal for christ's sake, this is a good spot to be in. Raise $40 tops pre, cbet half pot given action/texture, probably barreling turn because nothing scares us and maybe evaluate river is something insane goes down, otherwise bet that **** too with whoever is left if we still have the initiative.

edit: just saw results, and im not surprised in the slightest. This is live. This is the most standard kind of action in the world and you guys are tripping balls over playing with TPGK because it's multiway.

Good point Xtra, although our mind is deceiving.

Javi, we’re $800 eff. the SPR won’t be that small HU. QJs, AQo, KK- I play them all the same way in this spot. We just happen to be near the bottom of our range.

What does “playing poker” even mean? Is that what the bad regs are trying to do when they flat 3bets instead of shoving with AKs? Huh.

People have a hard time folding hands like 88s, J10s, that they’ve limped pre.

While this is marginal, it’s likely near the bottom of our range and we’ll have AKs, QQs-AA as well. I want to charge the max, within reason to get this HU and occasionally 3 ways vs a weaker range and weaker player.

We’re doing the exact opposite of “playing poker” in a 5 way pot anyways, so I’m not following that logic. Our hand plays itself this multi-way.