So I wasn’t playing the other day and this spot came up and I’m curious what people prefer to do in this specific spot.

Utg+1 has been a bit snug in last few hours but chatting with him seems to be competent. He 4b me earlier and told me since the other players have been opening more that he felt ak against me in the specific hand was worthy since I had been 3b a decent amount when they opened.

MP older Chinese man. Seems like a smart guy but he is very wide with his hand ranges. Loves to give action but doesn’t 3b a whole lot.

LJ is new to table no reads.

Button is your standard old nit. Typically very easy to read and plays his hand face up.

Hero has been most active at the table by far. Lots of opens and decent amount of 3b going on as well as the occasional 4b. Our image is pretty good as the hands I’ve shown down are either big hands or hands that got very unlucky but would be deemed raise worthy pre.

Effective stacks are pretty much 200bb+.

Utg1 opens to 25, Mp calls, Lj calls, button calls, we are in the sb with Ah 10h. Do you prefer a flat or 3b here?

One hundred and fifty dollars

Most people I discussed the hand with thought was better to call and close the action.

In my eyes i felt a 3b puts utg+1 in a difficult spot with anything but the top of his range since so many players behind him. If I get him to fold I feel my hand has a good chance of passing through uncontested.

You arent closing action tho...if this was bb call would be whatever.

Flatting sb is burning money in general even in live poker even when 17 people are giving you pot odds.

Preflop fold, call and raise all work. A raise to $150 is OK if you think if you have enough FE but if people are starting to play back at you this is a good one to let go from OOP. Fold is fairly nitty but you need a good flop to continue with ATs and the pot is going to be bloated. Despite needing a good flop calling is fine with the good direct and implied odds.

Absent any other information I prefer call. UTG+1 sounds like he is willing to play back at you and his EP opening range should have a good portion of hands that can call or reraise.

This is everything.

He did play back at me the one time but that was about it in the four hours or so we played. He seems competent but not sure how much he’s willing to gamble.

I can't imagine folding this with 200BB+ stacks in what's looking to be a 5way pot. There are many good things that can happen with this hand in a multiway pot - overflushing someone, making broadway vs 2pair or a smaller straight, etc. Plus I don't find one-pair hands to have much RIO with AT - it's usually pretty obvious when you're outkicked or whatever, especially in multiway pots.

3bet is definitely good. But if you've been 3betting a lot, then you start to increase the chance that you'll get played back at. Plus, there are some players that just seem to always respond to 3bets (when they think the 3bettor is at all capable of 3betting light) by 4betting... This is a hand that sucks a little bit too much to fold preflop, so I really don't want to 3bet if I think there's a good chance that I'll be 4bet. In those cases, I'd like to be a bit more polarized b/w hands I can 5bet or call and bluffs that I can easily fold. And I would press the call button now.

And honestly I don’t want to play 4-5 handed here oop

Thanks for the response. In the situation I really felt the only player who would 4b here is the original raiser. He had only done it once but I guess that’s more than anyone else who has tried to confront me with a reraise. Even in the one hand where the guy did 4b I still called( had QQ) so he may worry about big pots as it appears I won’t easily fold to his 4b

ATs is not too good of a hand to 4bet/fold. Wide 4bets in live poker are QQ/AK. Average 4bets are KK+.

That makes it an easy fold facing a 4bet.

Its fine playing more passively in the huge multiway pots that are live poker when you have position (tho I'd still 3bet here otb).

When you are in the sb, you prefer to scoop the dead money pre.

There's a dynamic here where UTG+1 pretty much knows your just trying to scoop up dead money. He opened early, and he's been playing snug so he might be at the top of his range and could jam as low as TT, or AKs.

I usually prefer 3betting but since the initial raiser is a bit narrow and he knows we should be light there's nothing wrong with flatting. I would hate to 3bet and have to fold especially when I have a multiway hand.

ATs ranks pretty far up there among most playable hands as a flat in the SB, probably second only to PPs. Squeezing this EP's opener in particular seems unappealing given they have a tight opening range and a wide continuing range.

Id flat ATs and raise or fold ATo. The fact were deep with a 2 way nut draw with great relative position after the flop I dont think id raise very often in this spot.

Agreed that it’s an easy fold to a 4bet. My point was that it’s a “damn I wish I had flatted bc this hand is good” kinda fold vs a hand like A5s or even A4o or K7o that is more of a pure bluff. Ie polarize ranges when 4bets are likely. Have a wider value range, and have high equity bluffs when villain is going to only fold or call with most of their range.

Also, players in my player pool are definitely learning to 4bet bluff to aggressive players/frequent 3bettors. I certainly throw in some 4bet bluffs occasionally, mostly with like AJ/AQo or A5s (I prefer to only 4bet AK if I think I can get TT-QQ to fold). So while I agree with your “wide 4bet range”, there definitely are people who 4bet bluff and 4bet bluff often enough at 200BB+ stacks for us to want to change our own 3bet range.

Fold pre

Interesting. You have a hand that can make the nuts in a lot of ways that is also easy to get away from if you only flop top pair. I might argue this is the best type of hand to play OOP 4-5 handed.

I don't think a 3! squeeze makes sense here unless we think we really have a good chance (say at least 70%) to take it down now. I hate 3!/folding and if V calls the 3! and we are HU OOP, I don't like that spot either.

I flat or fold in this spot most of the time depending on my image and the table dynamic in the last 30 minutes or so (generally, the outside of most people's memory).

I'm never flatting here either squeeze or fold