2-5 at Parx at about 3 AM on a Sunday morning. Hero has been at table for 12 hours and has been playing a lot of hands, raising pre-flop 15-20 percent of the time and 3 betting PF a few times in the last few hours as well. Has a loose-aggressive image and has a chip stack of $1,800.

Villain 1 has been at the table for 9 hours and has been the most aggressive player at the table, raising PF approximately 30-40 percent of the time. Has been running well and typically follows his PF raises with bets on the flop. He has a chip stack of $2,500.

Villain 2 has been at the table for 3 hours and has played very tight and solid, not getting involved in that many hands. He has a chip stack of $900.

Hero picks up AA in middle position. V1 raises to $25 under the gun, Hero re-raises to $75, V2 is on button and calls $75, V1 re-raises to $300. They are only three players left with cards.

Hero?

There was a lot of debate after the hand was over about what Hero did here, and I am interested in people's thoughts here.

It sounds like you are at a table with decent players. Unless you are very friendly with these guys away from the table, the only thing I would say is I wouldn't get involved in the post-hand debate.

I am definitely reraising here.

$800 and shove any flop if lolcalled

Calling to encourage another call with the plan of shipping over the c-bet you're expecting seems like the best and most profitable play.

Raising is also profitable and lower variance, which isn't an unreasonable consideration.

But a 5-bet seems so so strong. Hate to blow everyone off their dominated hands - and when you hold AA with a very low SPR, everyone is dominated.

Omfg.... 3b...cold call... 4b... Hero?

Hero has AA?

Boing!!!

Everyone has a hand here. Its cooler time!

5b to $550 and pray that V2 calls and V1 shoves.

Pretty sure if there's any time for a "decent" UTG player to fold KK, it's facing a 5-bet 300BB deep from hero in this very situation.

First world problems in this thread. I like flatting and hoping to lure the button in.

With AA and at that table with that effective stacks (ES) you got to raise at least 15% of ES. For example if you raise only 7-8% of ES in that case only half of ES can be let into play. You cannot play for stacks if pf raise was less then 15%. I hope you understand what 15% means and why is that so. Unless you flop a set of Aces, in that case rise up and let the storm break loose!

Now, to accomplish a 15% pf raise you need either to be in position and have a up-front dude bring it in for 2bet and you make it 3bet or if you are out of position you got to limp behind and have some cowboy from the back make it 2bet and you make it 3bet when the action comes around back to you. Or the best is u play "second hand low" where a dude on your right 2bet, you smooth call that and another dude behind makes it 3bet and have the original up-front man call that 3bet and you make it 4bet.

this deep you have to 5-bet. so many reason too, them being you are super deep so you lose a ton of value by just flatting, may get bluffed off hand on KQJ boards, etc., also 5betting can lead to KK, QQ, AK to spaz and shove

say he has KK and you flat a AQx board will kill yoir action

5 bet to 600

The 5 bet should get V1 to consider folding and I certainly agree with the logic presented that he might fold. The biggest issue here is to consider what V2 is likely to do with his $900 stack. He flatted your 3 bet and will face a 4 bet and an overcall for 1/3 of his stack in a situation where he knows he will get paid if he makes his set (assuming Hero flats $300 first). I don't like his odds, but he may decide that you will both donate to him if he flops a set here, tripling him up. This increases your chances of getting outflopped from 8:1 to about 3.75:1.

I don't like the reverse implied odds of allowing V2 in this pot. I would 5 bet here and put him to a decision for his stack. You stand a small shot at V1 folding here as well, but most 2/5 players will probably allow themselves to get coolered with KK.

I think given the description of V1, the best play here would be to flat pre.
V1 most likely will c bet most flops and we will be getting a ton of value.

This also allows V2 to ship over the top of us b/c we have disguised our hand.

IMO if you're at a table with good players and you make it like 800 pre, the only hand that will call you is kk

Good luck just trying to cooler people all the time and not just exploit said Villan

This is what we want, minus the additional risk of losing to a third hand. We don't play to cooler people all the time, but this is the situation that we have presented ourselves with. How on earth can V2 ship here?

If I was positive he would fold, I would flat as you suggested. Given his situation, I'm not so sure he would ship, but he might consider calling given that he knows both players have big hands and he could triple his stack. It's villain dependent, but what do you think is going to happen to Hero when he sees a KJx or QJx flop 3 handed with an SPR of 2.

I'm playing 12h?
I have a good profit and deep?
Vs 2 competents?
Sorry, but I don't play this hand
I shove

If all players fold, I have 375 of profit (20% about my stack) or I can to play vs only one player.

If you're only reason for shoving here is b/c you're up on the session then you should just move down or rack up pre.

We have the best starting hand possible. This **** does not come around often so when there's a chance of 2 villains putting huge chunks of their stacks in pre then we are profiting. Its so trivial. We know vill 1 is going to follow up. Most people ship aces here and that's why calling is such a sick line. Once we flat, this villain is probably salivating at the chance to run us over post flop. Why the hell are we worried about vill 2 like he has some secret hand that has more equity than us?

Math-wise you want both villains in the hand; H obviously has huge edge against two players. Flat V1's 4bet.
I'd expect V2 to fold. His passive call of H's $75 bet tends to indicate a lack of premium hand and set-mining for an additional $225 is possible but a fairly marginally profitable play. V2 is not described as a gambler.

HU in position with AA seems pretty good to me. Why 5-bet and risk V1 folding ?
A strong bet, say $900+ to immediately take down a nice little pot is fine if you're bankroll is on the thin side but try collect V1's anticipated c-bet and shove otf absent a really ugly flop.

if V2 gets involved H's chance of winning decreases by less than 20%. H wants these kinds of odds.

Actually ev-wise it's too bad there isn't another potential caller in the hand.

Hero re-raised it to 700, V2 folded almost immediately and V1 postured, talking about how he should have left an hour ago and how can he fold this hand, blah blah blah, and then of course folded. After the hand V2 said he had 10 10 and V1 didn't say what he had, but I'd guess he was trying to make a play and got caught.

In retrospect, while I am happy with my play, I think the chip stacks may have played into my decision more than they should have. If V1 was playing 800 instead of covering my 1,800, I may have just called with intention of going over top of his C bet on flop, which was most likely coming. The presence of V2 was also a main reason I re-raised in this spot, as I didn't want to have to dodge two potential sets, but in retrospect, as a pretty tight, solid player, he might have folded for 225 more with a pocket pair like 9 9 or 10 10. Then again he knows both Hero and V1 are aggressively playing a wide range and knows if he flops a set he is likely tripling up.

If I could play the hand over again I might have just called the 300.

This is not a reason to shove at all

I'm fine flatting or making it $600. V1 is auto cbetting a ton of boards and you shouldn't really have a 5b range beyond AA/KK so a flat looks good here.

[QUOTE=IbelieveinChipKelly;41345676]It sounds like you are at a table with decent players. Unless you are very friendly with these guys away from the table, the only thing I would say is I wouldn't get involved in the post-hand debate.

This I agree with. Let them debate and take notes.

I would have tanked a good 20 seconds then flatted, planning to shove all flops.

You have position here, use it. When you flat, the pot is going to be ~$700 (I'm assuming V2 folds - no one who is tight and solid is flatting a 3b and 4b), so V1 is going to have to cbet at least another ~$300 to look credible and your ship is going to be for just under pot size - he may feel committed with an overpair (don't laugh, I've seen people do this).

Lots of players at this level who are regulars in casinos get very lost playing deep stacked because the games are usually capped and tables don't get deep all that often. Being able to flat AA PF against this V is a move you need to be able to make. If you're 150bb or whatever, the hand plays itself, but when you're 300bb+, it takes more strategy to get players to stackoff early in the hand with something as weak as a single pair. Plan ahead and use position.

^^+100^^

I like this very much. You are right on the money. Please don't play at my table. ...lol...lol..., Honestly, I'm in total agreement with you.

Based on the action, it's not unreasonable to think V1 might have KK (or maybe QQ), and if KK will call you when you make it 800, KK will also stack off pre, no? IMO it looks stronger to 5b to 800 (or basically any other amount) than to 5b-shove. A 5b to 800 says you don't want KK to fold and you are committed; a 5b-AI could at least be perceived as an attempt to push KK off and induce a spazz-call.

IMO, Hero maximizes by shoving and hoping either V has KK (much more likely for V1 than V2) and stacks off.

Really have to agree with this.
The thing is here, that once V2 puts in 1/3 of his stack with any PP, he can never profitably play. He is making a mistake by ever being in the hand with anything. So, we don't want him to fold. If he gets lucky, then he gets lucky.

If V1 has KK he likely isn't going to fold now, or fold later (unless an A come on the flop) so it doesn't matter what we do. We are never folding in the hand either. So, lets try and target the parts of his range that are NOT KK and instead of just hoping that he has it, why don't we try to play and get QQ to stack off to us in a massive pot. Why don't we flat, and jam pretty much all flops?

He will cBet for $500 or so (half pot), we will have $1500 left, and we can jam for less than a pot sized bet. Seems pretty ideal. If he gets there, he gets there. Congrats, he still made a mistake. But we don't want him to fold just so that he doesn't have a chance to get lucky, do we?

Right, in retrospect after thinking about it for a while, I agree with this.