Just looking for some honest thoughts about whether I played this hand correctly, or how I might have played it better. Sorry if I'm not describing this well. First time post:

9 Handed 2-5 NLHE:

Hero: $750
UG: $1000
Button: $2500

UG limps in. Mid position limps in. Hero ($750) in the CO with A(d)K(h). I start thinking and intend to raise, but see the button, a fishy calling station who plays 90% hands take chips in his hand to make a standard raise on button. Seeing this, I just limp to reraise and get heads up or take the pot down after he makes a raise on the button. As predicted, the button raises to $20. The SB and BB fold. The limper, an aggressive young pro, thinks for a bit and calls. MP calls. I raise to $120. The button sighs, and calls reluctantly. (He's not Hollywooding, he just hates calling here, but does it anyway. He often does this.) UG thinks for a while and then also calls. MP folds. Three people to the flop.

Flop: 2(h) 3(d) 6(s). [Pot: $385]

UG checks. Hero in CO bets $245.
Button folds. UG calls.

Turn: K(s). [Pot: 975]

UG checks. Hero bets all in for the last of $385.

UG calls. He has a set of 2s.

Flop cbet was too big. Also we can check the flop, we are not obliged to cbet.

Hi, welcome to the forum. I suggest that you read the Driving guide thread at the top of the forum page.

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/17...stion-1618741/

One of the things you'll read is that putting the results of the hand biases the answers you get. It is better to leave them out.

As played, I would have checked the flop with with this many villains. Most likely, we can't fold any better hand. As played, you're never escaping after hitting TP.

Welcome to the forum!

Check the flop based on descript of the BTN. He will call with most of his pre-flop raise/call range on a 6-high board. Fold to a flop bet.

GL!

How much do you think would be a proper bet on that flop? Also, I understand that I could have checked on the flop, which may have been the right thing to , although, then I thought I would basically be giving up the pot. I thought a strong bet on the flop would help me represent a high pair, JJ+, especially after my $120 preflop raise.

Thanks, I will take a look at that and leave the results out in the future. If I check on the flop and I don't hit a A or K on the turn, does that mean I'm basically giving up the pot? I guess my bet on the flop was aimed at winning the pot there, and I thought the texture of the board was actually good for me. I guess I am often unsure in these situations where I'm in with AK after a big raise, and blank the flop. There's a fair amount of money out there (especially relative to my stack size), and so I thought it is better to make a bet and at least try to take it down, with the hope of seeing turn, and perhaps a free card to the river. I also thought that making a large preflop raise makes my range quite strong, which inclined me to bet on the flop.

Thanks again for the help.

cbetting here is terrible, cbetting with this gigantic sizing is probably the worst play in the entire game tree. Turn shove is just button clicking.

Otf you bet over half pot, ott 390 into 1k remained. When we bet 1/2 otf it should be better balanced size. Even less is possible.

Your preflop play is fine, however, once you play it that way, there's no way you can represent JJ+ on the flop. Nobody will ever believe you played JJ+ that way preflop. I wouldve put you on 77-99 or some weird other random hand. They dont know you only played preflop that way because you saw the button about to raise.

I probably wouldve checked the flop because one of them has an overpair to this flop most of the time. If I was going to bet it certainly wouldve been no more than $125 or so.

So is the problem the sizing, in which case, what would you recommend the sizing to be? Or should I simply not C-bet on this board at all?

But if you did put me on 77-99, then it seems that I would have gotten a fold anyways, I would think. I guess the real question here is: when do you c-bet and when do you not?

Thanks for the comments everybody. Another question: once I check on the flop, and the K hits on the turn (with my AK), is there a way for me not to lose the rest of my stack? I suppose the villain UG would have bet out, and I would have at least called. And then once he shoves on the river, do I just fold?

(By the way, the river was a non-flush making 6, thus pairing the 6s.)

Hypothetical questions are difficult. The more we know result (no offence, it is rather recommendation than a rule not posting result).
One way is btn stabs and UTG calls (or raises) and easy fold with AK. Another possible way is that you fold AK otr thinking: "V has none or very few bluffs, K is terrible card for him, AK is only bluffcatcher". But AK is also your best hand played this way, maybe you can fold a part of them but not 100%.
Anyway checking flop is not to avoid loss to set rather trying realize equity.

There are only two V's on the flop. Cbetting should certainly be considered IMO. If I cbet, it's going to be at least half the pot ~190+. I'm not saying 245 is the best sizing, but I don't think it's horrible.

I think the most important factor in the hand is the station on the button:

His presence will tend to increase the number of IO hands reg would play, putting more hands he'll fold to a cbet in his range.

The station protects the pot. On the one hand, bluffs are less likely to succeed because the button is more likely to call. On the other hand, reg will interpret bets are being stronger and will therefore be somewhat more likely to fold.

So the key is button's range. What does he raise/call with pre? If it's just big pairs, we're crushed and can quietly x/f each street. If we can add some big cards AK, AQs then we need to know whether he'll give up now or will call with just the overs crappy BD wheel draw. If his range is relatively narrow and he'll call the flop even with just two overs, we can quietly x/f each street unimproved.

I'd estimate that reg will fold about 55% of his hands (see range in footnote). We'd need button to also fold about 67% to make a 200 cbet breakeven (not including our chance to suckout if called). I think we're not getting there.

So without a read on button that indicates he'll fold most of his range, I'd give up.



Footnote:
I'm giving reg a range like: 99-22,AJs-A2s,KJs-KTs,QTs-Q9s,JTs-J8s,T9s-T7s,98s-96s,87s-86s,76s-75s,65s,54s

If he'll call with any piece of the board (any pair, OESD or combo draw), he's folding 55%. I think he'll fold some crappy pairs like A2s and may fold some overpairs to the board since our bet will be pot committing and he has some RIO.

$0 sounds proper. It's totally okay(correct) to have a certain group of hands that you check on flops like this, even considering the way you played preflop. Opponents at this level likely aren't planning to call preflop with, say, 88 just to fold to a flop bet. Whether they should call with small pairs pre against your line is another discussion, but you won't do well trying to make them fold on all low card flops. They'll tend to spot you AK and call down... Sometimes saving a bet is the better play.

You avoid going broke by calling turn and folding river most of the time, not raising. Sure, the K probably gives you the best hand, but how many worse hands are likely to put $630 more into the pot against you? Not many/any. Look at it this way, if either opponent has QQ and the flop checks through, the turn is a K, will they get all in against you by the river without hitting a Q?

Make a standard raise pre, the limp rr is just bad imo, your hand looks exactly like what it is and an observant player might think you are face up. Not to mention your stack size is awkward

As played c bet smaller...40% of pot seems about right to me

I check back turn for showdown value and soul read

Honest opinion is this hand is played like an amateur

Oh i also hate the pf sizing too why are we making it 6x 20 pre, are you sure you want them to fold dominated Ax and Kx?

limp re-raise here is suboptimal against a calling station. Its Even worse against a calling station that is opening from the button. To put it simply, this guy aint folding. Instead of putting yourself in a position where you have to try to bluff off a calling station OOP, you are better off calling his PF raise, and getting 2, possibly 3 streets of value when you flop an A or K against his dominated Ax or Kx

Since you cbet the flop into two players you're either hoping to get worse to fold or better to call...

I would check the flop, bet the turn, and bet the river for value

If the villian raises us then it's an easy fold.

What could the villian possibly have that we beat when he calls our cbet on the flop? His range is polarized to either a pocket pair, set, straight, or a bluff.

Regarding the l/rr discussion...

I think the problem here is reads on V. I'm not saying they're wrong, just that they're not particularly informative to this hand and that I think there is very likely important info behind them that isn't divulged (and perhaps therefore not considered important).

V plays 90% of his hands preflop. Useful info, just not preflop in this hand.

We critically need to estimate his button raising range. There are loose V's that raise too much, and others that raise squeaky tight -- down to KK+ in some cases.

Do we have any indication how he'll likely react to a 3b and particularly l/rr?

"Calling station" is minimally informative. OK, he calls too much. Pre, post, or both? Obviously he's at least limping pre with all kinds of junk pre (90% of his hands), but is he calling raises with that wide a range? Any indication of how he handles a 3b?

Post, does he overvalue TP, any pair, draws OTF? OTT? To showdown? How does he react to big absolute or relative bets? Can you manipulate him with your bet sizing?

I realize you probably don't have all this information, but "calling station" doesn't really give any of the information you must have behind that judgment.

Depending on his raising range, AK could be a snap fold (along with self back pat for avoiding the guy that raises only KK+) or it could be a l/rr or it could be l/c or perhaps even a raise from us.

That said, I'm almost always limping here. We derive a huge positional advantage in the preflop betting round by doing that if he does indeed raise.

Whether I rr depends on his raising range, how he'll react to the 3b, and how many other people call.

The presence of the pro is unwelcome. I'd rather be OOP with a calling station than between the pro and the calling station. A limp/call from a pro is usually an IO type hand -- PP, SCs, S1Gs, suited big cards. If button has a relatively tight raising range and pro has a range heavy in IO hands, all flops become harder to evaluate. This makes rr more attractive, if only to trash pro's implied odds.

Without more detailed information, responders are forced to guess. You'll get widely different answers depending on what we decide to construct behind the info you provide.