Local underground $2/$5 NLHE game, 10 handed.

V1 (CO, $360) - White guy, mid-late 20's, athletic build, wearing jeans and a t-shirt, large and remarkably intricate tattoo of Jesus on his forearm. Not sure, but I’m guessing he’s in the military. Brand new to the game, has only been at the table like two orbits. Has played maybe 3 or 4 hands so far, every time he came in for a raise to $20 preflop, no showdowns yet.

V2 (SB, $190) - OMC, tight/passive but not nitty. Can show up with surprisingly weak hands when he’s calling down an aggressive player, but usually only raises when he has the nuts.

Hero (BTN, $675) - White guy, early 30's. Image is normally somewhere between TAG and nit, but haven’t played any pots with V1 yet and really don’t know how he views me at this point.

On to the hand:
V1 opens to $20, Hero calls with KQ, V2 calls from the SB and the BB folds.

Flop ($60): A87
V2 checks, V1 cbets $55, Hero calls and V2 calls.

Turn ($220): T
V2 checks, V1 bets $125, Hero ???

As played I actually think the turn is a fairly easy decision, but would love to get feedback on hero’s line so far.

I think I am folding the turn. Line is fine up to that point but I don't think either villain is deep enough to justify drawing. Especially in this spot where our implied odds are not as great as even when we get there, we may not get the rest unless V1 has AxQd.

You should probably consider that given the effective stack size(s) you are likely giving up FE by just calling the flop.

Now I am curious what you think is a fairly easy decision on turn.

Yea I think folding the turn is the best. Got to watch his stack and consider your chances

Looking good imo.

I don't like raising the flop. V is strong to bet 3-way on this board and with this sizing, and I don't expect him to fold top pair+ to a semi-bluff. Ax hands are the most common hands in villain's range imo.

Doubt we have much fold equity, and I'm not really wanting to punt as a 65/35 dog. If there's any doubt, having the stationy V2 still in the hand makes a call even better. Obviously, we'd like them both to fold - but if we can't get the main V to fold often enough, the next best thing is to keep both villains in the hand with a call and give ourselves better odds/more reward for drawing.

I feel the same way on the turn. Not interested in raising, and I agree it's a fairly easy decision. Call.

You need ~3:1 with your gut shot + flush draw, you're getting just about 3:1 direct, and there's a good chance V2 sticks around with w/e (giving you nearly ~4:1 when he does call). You can get paid on rivers. Villains can easily make second-best flushes (i.e. AxJd type hands for V1, QdJx type hands for for V2), refuse to fold two-pair+, etc.

Against a range of AA/TT/88/77, AK-AT, we are 36% and we are just getting the right price now we've picked up a gutter draw.

If this guy has already opened 3-4 times in two orbits and he's opening the CO, this is a 3-bet pre for value.

As played, V1 is probably committed so you're barely getting an EV+ payoff to shove. $125 * 4 = $500, with 4-1 odds of catching a river diamond.

Flop - I'd either fold (lack of implied odds) or raise (FE plus outs to NF).

Pretty on-par with my thoughts.

Fold pre. Calling with KQ you definitely don't have a TAG image.

Raise large or fold on the flop. Unless he raises QdJd pre-flop, or flopped top set, he can't be happy about this flop.

I would fold pre. As played, I think calling flop is fine, but a raise is never a bad idea against this guy. I call turn with the gutshot expecting V2 to call.

I'm not folding KQo on the BTN facing a CO open.

I like playing in position against ranges I dominate.

Pre, 3-bet or call are our options.

You are right, a 3bet is good against this guy. I don't like just calling, though. I'd rather just fold if I'm not going to 3bet.

Even though V hasn't played nearly enough to have a clear read, i'm reluctant to 3b KQ BTN vs CO since we're folding out a LOT of hands we dominate.
against shallow stacks like these i'm folding otf.
I don't like raising, because V1 pots the flop into 3 people on a wet board, so we can't assume we have any FE here, especially without any clear reads on him.
We don't have calling odds against someone with 70bbs + our 0 implied odds with our completely undisguised draw

Calling the flop is fine.

V1 doesn't always continue to fire turn. Given read, V2 can definitely stick around with terrible/dominated hands. V1 will have around $285 behind when we call $55.

I hear you that our draw is obvious so our implied odds are less, and that's a good point. But getting 2:1 direct on the flop (with 3:1 with V2 calls) in the best position with the best draw and these dynamics, I call.

I don't really understand the purpose of 3-betting.

Is it for value to get raise/calls from KJ, QJ, XX?

Is it a bluff to get hands like Ax to fold knowing we block QQ-KK,AK?

I think it's best to call in position against a villain who can easily have a dominated range (KJ, QT, QJ, QT, etc). If we 3-bet, I think it's mostly a bluff and that he continues with better hands and folds worse ones.

What range would cbet flop then check turn on this board into a short stack and third player OOP?

If such range exist, isn't it better to max FE against it?

Makes sense, but know that FE is virtually eliminated if V bets turn.

I'm not a fan of calling with KQo, even in position. If this guy has been opening a lot then KQ might have him dominated -- yes, I'd rather take it down right now or find out if he does have a much better hand or have him call with worse and play post-flop poker. Not many flops we want to see w/ KQ against a pre-flop aggressor when we've never seen a hand.

Disagree. KQ rates to be ahead of this particular opponent's range. Flatting to keep our's and his range wide is fine and if we flop good, we stand to make a lot of money.

I think 3-betting is fine as well, depending on our image. If we're perceived to be fairly tight (as hero is), we can get folds from hands that have significant equity against us (pocket pairs, AT-AQ, etc). If we get called, we can narrow his range and he'll play a lot more straight-forwardly against our perceived strong range.

villains range stands to be fairly wide when he opens the co. I am three betting a pretty high percentage of the time. I have position and will gain initiative post flop.

As played, we virtually no FE when the villain essentially pots the flop. There is no sense in raising. What are we trying to accomplish -- making the villain fold an Ace? Not happening with his flop bet size.

To answer the question, if all our outs are good then yes we have the odds to continue,

The problem is we are up against 2 V's and our straight outs may be dead against a made Flush, and are Flush outs may be drawing thinner due to V's drawing to a flushes with something like AxJ and AxT

I hate the 3bet pre.

This sums it up well.

If we get called by villians new narrower 3bet calling range, and we flop top pair we are usually decimated and can hardly get away with these stack sizes.

We have position.
We dont want to blow out villians ranges that we dominate.

I agree with the turn being a 10 we can barely call again otherwise I muck it.

I agree we have almost no fold equity on flop against this guy with this sizing, he likely never even folds 2p.

Thanks for the input everyone!

My thoughts: I did consider 3betting preflop, but I felt like KQo was probably strong enough against V1's CO opening range that I could just call and see a flop in position, especially since I'm never getting squeezed by either of the blinds unless they had QQ+.

On the flop I wasn't really sure what V1's likely range would be for cbetting close to pot on a monotone ace-high board, but I'm definitely not folding the nut flush draw at this point. Raising crossed my mind again, but I don’t know if V1 is capable of folding Ax here and I didn't really want to stack off with a naked flush draw, so I decided to just call. V2's overcall is a little concerning, but like I said before he calls down much lighter than a typical OMC. At this point I think he can have any pair+diamond, any Ax with or without a diamond, and small flopped flushes.

On the turn, I think my gutshot is very likely to be good if it comes in, so we've got 12 outs and I'm getting almost 3:1 in immediate odds. And V2 only has $115 left at this point, so (1) we don’t have to worry about him raising, and (2) he probably isn’t going to fold for that amount after he called on the flop. So we can actually look at this as calling $125 to win $585 assuming V2 is going to come along. And V1 also has another $160 behind, so we do have some implied odds if we wind up over-flushing him on the river.

So yeah, as played I think the turn is a pretty easy call.

Results in case anyone is interested:

wtf thats tilting, i proceed to shove over any further raises by V1

+1

Wow.