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Live Low-stakes NL Discussion of up to 3/5 live no-limit, pot-limit and spread-limit Texas Hold'em poker games, situations and strategies.

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Old 09-15-2018, 03:34 AM   #1
Pork Fri Rize
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2/5 KK @ Borgata

Hero TAG. Card dead 2 hours have raised 2 hands pre QQ and JJ both times multiple calls and multiple overs so we check fold both spots.

Otth: new player UTG+1 or +2 don't remember who has been @ table probably 30 mins, doesn't know me or that ive got very tight image ($800ish) initally bought in 5, added 3 opens 25. fishy middle aged Asian woman (7-800) calls, folds to hero on btn, raises to 105 ($550). Could have gone slightly larger but given my position and eff. Stack with fishy villain I don't mind it.

Euro(may not have been) also new to game in BB around 650 has done weird thjngs, seems awkaward with live play, althouf have seen him open UTG to $11. But I don't think it's because of online back round given his manerisims. Yes 1s play here at the 2/5. Flats ! Folds to raiser who calls, Fish woman folds.

flop$340ish) 994 rainbow . Euro leads $100. Open raiser flats. At this point I'm thinking he can flat here with TT-QQ hoping I have AK. Although QQ could be less likely with no 4bet pre but not enough history. Shouldn't really have any 9s pre nor 44. Anyways, we GII for like 425 or so. Euro folds open raiser calls.

Thoughts please
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Old 09-15-2018, 06:01 AM   #2
ChrisV
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Re: 2/5 KK @ Borgata

All looks pretty straightforward tbh.
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Old 09-15-2018, 06:03 AM   #3
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Re: 2/5 KK @ Borgata

100% standard.

Never folding KK on that flop with less than pot size left behind.
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Old 09-15-2018, 08:15 AM   #4
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Re: 2/5 KK @ Borgata

Very strong flat (flop) in between a cold caller and the 3-bettor. Nonetheless, on this texture and < PSB left, shoving is standard. If he had AA, bad luck.
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Old 09-15-2018, 12:17 PM   #5
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Re: 2/5 KK @ Borgata

UTG raisers flat on flop is reason I almost wanted to fold because he didn't seem like an idiot and , should realize I can have more QQ+ than AK,

Anyway V shows Tc9c
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Old 09-15-2018, 06:11 PM   #6
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Re: 2/5 KK @ Borgata

Grunch

Seems fine to me. Mostly I concur the weird cold call vs your 3bet is QQ-TT AK. If V is really fishy he can have big AXs KQs maybe small pairs. When he GII on flop I'm thinking "logically you should have 18 combos of QQ-TT here and nothing else but since you're weird you're going to have one of the 4 combos of A9s/T9s, 3 combos of 4 or 1 of 99." Then I'll find it amusing when I find I was drawing to 2 outs.

Certainly you want to GII on flop at this SPR and before an Ace turns.

Unfortunate cooler I guess

Edit: misread action, thought Euro cold called went with it on flop. With the PFR flatting pre only after the cold caller preflop he can have a wider range than usual against your 3bet. I think he still should have a bunch of QQ-TT here but you're definitely in a spot where two players can potentially have 9X or 44. I think you've always got to go with it at this SPR but it's less surprising when you're beaten now I read the flop action correctly.

I'd never be able to fold flop or avoid raising - you still want all the money in before an Ace comes IMO.
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Old 09-15-2018, 06:19 PM   #7
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Re: 2/5 KK @ Borgata

Puke T9s is such a stupid call preflop at this stack depth. One of those sessions I guess.
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Old 09-15-2018, 06:21 PM   #8
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Re: 2/5 KK @ Borgata

I agree that not folding flop is standard but I prefer a call to a raise.
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Old 09-15-2018, 08:43 PM   #9
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Re: 2/5 KK @ Borgata

Not sure how we can just call flop as others have said with my spr ratio then it's just ridic when an A comes on turn which it actually did, and potential euro guy will lead again. Not enough bad cards on turn for this board to just call but maybe I'm wrong since the cold call from UTG raiser on flop sucks
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Old 09-15-2018, 09:16 PM   #10
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Re: 2/5 KK @ Borgata

Flatting flop is OK. You’re essentially worried about 3 aces? There’s not a single bad card in the entire deck otherwise, if you even want to consider an A a bad card.
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Old 09-15-2018, 10:45 PM   #11
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Re: 2/5 KK @ Borgata

As per what other poster above said if A rolled off on turn that hits a decent amount of donk leads from euro guy on flop
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Old 09-16-2018, 07:22 AM   #12
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Re: 2/5 KK @ Borgata

If you're targeting basically both villains' JJ/TT then any of the 4 Aces, two Kings or 4 Queens on the turn potentially kill your action with quite a few hundred still left behind.

Also if you flat flop, A or Q hit turn and one or both villains want to keep putting chips in the pot - what are you going to do? It starts to look strongly like you're no good but Euro guy is so weird you can't be sure. Potential for a mistake arises in A/Q turn as well as killing your action other times.

It's also not like flatting flop prevents you losing your stack to 9X when an A or Q doesn't turn.

What flatting flop does do is help both opponents keep putting in chips with QQ-TT whereas your shove on flop may force those hands to play perfectly and fold while only the weird 9X, AA and 44 get it in. This is villain dependent - many are just never folding and overpair here and never have AA and hardly ever have 9X.

In hindsight these players are likely both a bit weird, but you couldn't know that for sure before - and as weird as they are I doubt either folds QQ-TT on this flop.
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