I think you'll get check/raised on this board texture pretty often. For that reason I think it's best to check the flop here. As played turn shove is mandatory. Pre depends on your read of the first couple limpers and if they could be going for a limp/rr.
I think you'll get check/raised on this board texture pretty often. For that reason I think it's best to check the flop here. As played turn shove is mandatory. Pre depends on your read of the first couple limpers and if they could be going for a limp/rr.
God why is everybody so afraid of getting check-raised? Just fold ffs. Or call or reraise if you think you're ahead and have the right equity.
Actually scratch what I said. Please check flop. I'm sure I play against some of you here, and I haven't been flopping enough sets. I could really use that extra 5% with 66 on this flop. And maybe it's not profitable, but I sometimes want to call OOP with 57. How the hell am I supposed to win with that hand when I'm priced out on the flop? Definitely do check.
P.S. - If you don't do as I say, I will check-raise you to oblivion with my 66 on this flop. You are warned. Be careful.
I agree with most posters who say this is a standard line given the dynamics. Good post though, this is a situation that comes up often enough and the flop is a spot that is easy to misplay.
Obv calling Preflop can't be terrible, but raising is good in a lot of games. I think we can size a little smaller on the flop assuming we're b/fing, but other than that I like the line.
I could go both ways pre, JTs is a nice hand to play MW but not hating raising either.
As played it seems pretty standard not loving getting it in but is a lot out there that can catch up so might as well get it.
Is just a high variance style of play if your bankroll can handle it
Agree preflop could go either way, I was influenced to raise because the UTG limper sucked and because I'd been so tight. I don't mind the spot I got into preflop, most players were substantially deeper than the main villain.
An interesting discussion would be whether we can ignore the straddle for the most part and size down our raise to the $30 range.
If we believe:
1) Villains have an inelastic calling range between $30-50;
2) We expect at most 2-3 callers on average; and
3. We don't believe villains would be more likely to 3! our smaller sizing in a straddled pot
Then I think we can make a case for sizing down our raise to manipulate the SPR to a size that better suits our hand and postflop playability. I would like something in the $30-35 range. It prevents us from limping behind and potentially being forced to call a raise that is $50+, possibly from a steal range that wouldn't have even called our raise in the first place.
For example, if we made it $30 and got the same 4 callers now we have a pot of $150 instead of $250 and can feel better value betting the flop and turn without immediately being pot committed. And getting 4 callers pre is a very right tail outlier type event (similar to a left tail event like his $50 raise taking the pot down preflop).
More often then not we see a 3-way flop or something with a very manageable SPR for our hand. We basically ignore the straddle and treat the hand like a normal 2/5 hand with a little extra dead money.
But this requires having a good read for the table dynamics in play.
betting flop is pretty much mandatory in my book. yeah, you've gone 5 ways with JT but you rate to have the best hand now but certainly are unlikely to have the best hand on the turn with four others in the pot.
betting flop is pretty much mandatory in my book. yeah, you've gone 5 ways with JT but you rate to have the best hand now but certainly are unlikely to have the best hand on the turn with four others in the pot.
Even with initiative, this isn't a compelling enough reason to bet all the way down to a dry JT 5 ways, this deep, when you too often will have to surrender that bet (and your equity) on so many turns/rivers (or flop ck-r).
Preflop: Looks fine. Limping is behind is also fine. Flop: I'd prefer to check back the flop. I don't think bet/folding the flop is horrible; I just think it's sub-optimal. Turn: As played, this is a clear shove. Nh.
Some of these posts are a little ridiculous. I am betting that flop every single time in this situation. More often than not, it folds out on the flop. Winning.
If I get one or two callers maybe I will check back the turn. It depends on how I read their hands. If they are both short like in this situation I will probably gii. More times than not I am the victor. Winning.
If I am betting my over pairs here, my sets and Axss then I will certainly bet this hand. More often than not I am the victor. Winning.
You absolutely need to try and reduce the amount of players in the hand. You could bet smaller and achieve the same effect as the 150. I think 125-140 would work just as well.
If you get multiple callers, then you can re-evaluate your action on the turn. If someone is calling off with QJ on the turn, that is a losing play imo. Calling off with KJ is debatable at best and is why you are cautioned to avoid it.
