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2/5 Deepstack Line Check 2/5 Deepstack Line Check

06-10-2015 , 11:33 AM
2/5 Deepstack at local casino. Generally a very good game and usually attracts 5/10+ players. $400-1k buyin. You can run it twice here.

V1 ($500) UTG Old bad nit. Has played maybe 2 hands in the hour and a half? He just got busted twice, and seems to be tilting a bit. I can't recall the first stack off, but he just raised pre, then c-bet $100 on a 6 high board, got min raised, called, turn 9, he checked, and other person put him allin and he called with a set of 9's and the river was a 10 giving the other person a set of 10's.

V2 ($1200) SB 5/10 player and a huge gambler. Hes actually a good player, but likes to gamble. I've noticed when he talks, hes "comfortable" with his hand. he limp/called a $250 3bet pre with 35 then got it in when he floped an open ender + FD vs an overpair and chopped. Also saw him limp/call a $200 raise with Q9 from a huge whale at the table because he had a "feeling" then flopped a flush draw, pushed, and the whale folded. Hes been straddling UTG/BTN every time and even calling/raising blind.

Hero (Covers) Btn Hasn't done anything out of line, only big hand I played, UTG raises, caller, I make it $70 with aces, UTG makes it $200, we get it in for like $600 each and my aces hold.

Hero straddles OTB for $10
V2 limps, BB limps, V1 limps, another limp, and hero checks with A3

Flop ($50)
AK6

Checks around to V1, who bets $60, folds to hero who raises to $200, Sb tanks, then flats, and V1 flats.

I raised here assuming that V1 has a pretty big hand and I felt he was just going to shove, and we can run it twice, and that'll be that.
Once V2 calls, It kinda worries me... I feel like he can have a Combo draw, sets, or 2p Hands.


Turn ($650)
AK6 - 10

V1 shoves for ~$250, Hero calls, V2 tanks and says, "Oh boy this is it..." and ships for ~$1k total, ~$750 back to hero, who sigh calls and says, "once or twice"

When he shoves the turn, He has to have either a set, or QJ it seems like. I mean, He COULD have like Qx for the 2nd nut flush, then turns a gutshot as well? But I feel his range is more of 2p at a bare minimum.

Is my call OTT bad? Its ~$750 to win... ~$2150, we can run it twice.
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06-10-2015 , 11:42 AM
The only way I call is if I think my pair of aces has some SDV. Which is not the case here.

Nit is not putting in all his chips with anything that we can beat.

Gambler coming over the top could be a FD, could be AT, could be QJ. I doubt hes doing this without a made hand though.

I'm throwing math out the window here, along with my hand.

Fwiw, I probably would have flatted the flop and re-evaluated OTT. This sets up an easier hand for us. Now we have a bloated pot, 2 shoves, a monster draw, and weak made hand.
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06-10-2015 , 12:05 PM
SB has a history of wild play and you just witnessed him cold call a bet and your flop raise after checking, which probably shouldn't have been too big a surprise.

With a drawing hand like yours in a multi-way large pot, it's unlikely your A and 3 play, so you're really just drawing to the flush at this point. I would have preferred to keep the pot multi-way and managable when drawing to the nuts on the flop. So I like a turn flat of V1s bet here.

By raising on the flop, you're normally hoping it will net you a free card on the turn, but given V1's lead out, and SB's tendency to throw money around, you're not likely to get that free card.

Also, does the ability to 'run it twice' in a game drastically change your strategy? Does it make you and others at the table more aggresive with draws on the flop?
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06-10-2015 , 12:06 PM
i need to revise my 2nd paragraph.. I like a FLOP flat of V1's bet
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06-10-2015 , 01:03 PM
Why are we straddling if we're not popping it when we have a suited ace against limpers?
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06-10-2015 , 01:14 PM
raise pre (check is okay too).

Flat the flop.
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06-10-2015 , 01:45 PM
Yeah ... never raising a donking V1 here without a bit more. I can see trying to get to a side pot with V2 perhaps, but he has checked here. If he had flatted V1 before you acted then maybe different. I want to flat and have V2 help me with my implied odds here ... also want to hide my hand a bit since Hero didn't raise straddle with Ax.

AP ... Your PSR is good, but why not just over-bet if your intention was to gii with V1 'from behind'. There really isn't much to chop here ($50) and you know you are probably only 25% to do so. There is no dead money from V2 yet ...

AP ... What does your flat of V1 tell V2? (If anything) I think you are really narrowing your range for these 2 guys both OTF and OTT by your actions. Flatting Turn may appear strong or drawing .. not sure your image to V2. We still aren't priced into a flush draw call which means we are giving our Ax a lot of credit here ... we can't count on V2 coming along and I really think about folding to a raise from V2.

I like, but don't like, the speech. The words themselves scream weakness IMO, but anytime a whale makes a speech I tend to worry ... unless he talks all the time. This again comes down to what I think he thinks Hero has for a range. I can still fold here sometimes, but want to evaluate the speech quite a bit in my decision.

Once we raise we really aren't priced into much going forward. The only thing going for us is that we might be able to surprise these guys with Ax here. Pairing the board doesn't beat AQ.

Eh, tough spot, easy to be critical, understand what you wanted to do .. just don't know why you would want to chop $50 at 25% draw? GL
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06-10-2015 , 02:21 PM
You put V1 on a big hand and THEN raise him with a weak made hand. So you are relying on the flush or 3 to win you the hand. You chose the "it's fun to gamble line" not the "I have a read let me play accordingly, line"
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06-10-2015 , 02:26 PM
Your biggest leak in this hand, by far, is that you're taking into account in your strategy the ability to run it twice.

What would you have done differently if you could not have run it twice?
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06-10-2015 , 07:07 PM
Grunch.

It seems like your post outlines exactly why I like the fact that my room allows players to run it twice. Looks like you are just looking to get it in bad and hope to bink one board. You basically state that you think that V1 has you beat... but you want to get all the money in?!? Why??? You understand that running it twice doesn't change your equity in the pot right? Pretend that you can only run it once... do you still want to get all-in against the nit OTF? You would need to improve in most cases IMO.

As played OTF, I really don't like the c/r. Lead the flop for value and get called by worse straight and flush draws. No need to c/r unless you think players will fold Ax with a better kicker than yours often. I'm not going to go into details about the post flop action after that, but I will honestly suggest that you re-evalute your understanding of running it twice because at this point it seems you are using it as a justification to get your whole stack in as a dog.
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06-10-2015 , 08:52 PM
I don't think two pair is good, and the 10 might be dirty. Getting 3:1 I guess you have to fold.

Why did we raise the flop exactly? Can we really get our nit to fold AQ, AJ?
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06-10-2015 , 09:32 PM
No reason to raise the flop and isolate. V1 is unlikely to fold, better off trying to keep the pot multiway and simply call turn (depending on sizing) fold the river if you brick because your ace won't have SDV w/out hitting 2p.
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06-10-2015 , 11:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThaNEWPr0fess0r
Grunch.

It seems like your post outlines exactly why I like the fact that my room allows players to run it twice. Looks like you are just looking to get it in bad and hope to bink one board. You basically state that you think that V1 has you beat... but you want to get all the money in?!? Why??? You understand that running it twice doesn't change your equity in the pot right? Pretend that you can only run it once... do you still want to get all-in against the nit OTF? You would need to improve in most cases IMO.

As played OTF, I really don't like the c/r. Lead the flop for value and get called by worse straight and flush draws. No need to c/r unless you think players will fold Ax with a better kicker than yours often. I'm not going to go into details about the post flop action after that, but I will honestly suggest that you re-evalute your understanding of running it twice because at this point it seems you are using it as a justification to get your whole stack in as a dog.
terrible advice all the way around. of course, not understanding the action could be part of that
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06-11-2015 , 03:17 AM
So obviously if we are raising here it's a bluff and we want folds. You seem to suspect that you have no fold equity and are behind, in that case I would flat with large equity and hope to hit turn. Turn decision will depend on his sizing if we miss. Also I in general prefer to play pair and FD stronger if I flop middle or bottom pair with it than top pair. You have more equity vs TPGK and there are more hands worth folding out with a bluff.
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06-11-2015 , 03:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DonkSlayer
Why are we straddling if we're not popping it when we have a suited ace against limpers?
Does the straddle in your room start the action with the SB or does it start with UTG? Is it only live if someone else raises?

Edit: Nevermind, checked the OP.

Any reason you didn't raise? Just wondering what your straddle philosophy is.
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