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2/5 - AJo in a tough turn spot facing C/R 2/5 - AJo in a tough turn spot facing C/R

06-09-2016 , 11:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SwolyswoND
After the turn, Villain has the range advantage over us. I don't want to give up my position and equity for the river (as his range advantage means we can often get c/r here) just to eek out a little more value out of two hand combinations. As another poster said, this is a two-street value hand.
Bet turn and fold to a check raise. It's still a 2 street hand. Same as calling a river bet.

If you check back turn, and river brings a scare card, it may go check check and you lose 1 street of value vs KJ, QJ, TT, etc etc.

You are therefore risking giving up one street of value vs those hands and trading it for potentially a street of value by inducing a bluff or light value bet on the river. Don't think it's the most profitable move.
2/5 - AJo in a tough turn spot facing C/R Quote
06-11-2016 , 12:26 PM
It looks like QQ-AA should be a call for sure but AJ may be a fold. If AJ is a fold then the turn bet sizing might be a mistake. I want to bet large on turn with a range of about half bluffs with outs (E.G. 10-9s) and half value hands THAT CAN CALL a turn check/raise+river shove.

QQ-AA, JJ, Q10s, and 88 are all hands Id raise pre and bet flop with and that's 28 combos. How's the following look for a $100 turn bet bluff range? These are all hands I'd raise pre and bet flop with.

910, 910, 910, 87, 87, 87, AK, AQ, A10, KQ, K10, 77, 1010, 55.
2/5 - AJo in a tough turn spot facing C/R Quote
06-11-2016 , 04:29 PM
I'd be more polar than that. Check back pretty much all the pairs (I wouldn't much bet flop with the 8x- anyway) and some of the spade draws, and bet more dry KQ and KTs type stuff. It's a good spot to barrel blank runouts, especially with hands that unblock spades and Tx/7x.

EDIT: Whoops, dry KQ is the super gutshot. Def don't want to fold out Qx nor be raised off our hand with those. Would make our bluffs more dry AK/AQ type stuff then.

Last edited by RaiseAnnounced; 06-11-2016 at 04:39 PM.
2/5 - AJo in a tough turn spot facing C/R Quote
06-12-2016 , 11:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SwolyswoND
After the turn, Villain has the range advantage over us. I don't want to give up my position and equity for the river (as his range advantage means we can often get c/r here) just to eek out a little more value out of two hand combinations. As another poster said, this is a two-street value hand.
Thing is villain will have a range advantage here... but will he realize that he does lol?

If he does then we can expect a lot more bluffs in this spot like x-raise bluffs because he can have more value hands. But i think most LLSNL don't even know what "range advantage" means. If this guy is a really good player or online kid who is good i think xing here has a little bit more consideration.
2/5 - AJo in a tough turn spot facing C/R Quote
06-12-2016 , 11:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cassurai
Bet turn and fold to a check raise. It's still a 2 street hand. Same as calling a river bet.

If you check back turn, and river brings a scare card, it may go check check and you lose 1 street of value vs KJ, QJ, TT, etc etc.

You are therefore risking giving up one street of value vs those hands and trading it for potentially a street of value by inducing a bluff or light value bet on the river. Don't think it's the most profitable move.
The reason why betting the flop + turn with TPTK is still profitable @ LLSNL is because nobody over-folds TP to a turn barrel or even mid pair sometimes (we aren't playing online).
What would happen if people started folding the turn at a high frequency w/TP or all their middling hands + draws? We would obviously make less money by betting the turn (duh). But lets be realistic ppl make horrible calling mistakes that are so -EV at LLSNL there are whales for miles here.

And vs. some villain's you can 3-barrel TPTK IP OTR if it's a spot where you are never going to fire 2 barrels and villain loves to hero + doesn't fold to 3 barrels as well as some other factors...

But sometimes i like having a xing range OTT very dependent tho. Or it may be more +EV to check instead of bet/fold here vs. some guys. Etc.

Last edited by Evoxgsr96; 06-12-2016 at 11:39 PM.
2/5 - AJo in a tough turn spot facing C/R Quote

      
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