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Old 10-28-2018, 04:55 AM   #1
maplestar
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2/5 78s flopped trips facing 130bb shove

10-handed 2/5 game.Villian is a semi loose regular in this room and limp/calls a lot with SC or suited one gapper.He is not very aggressive postflop.This is how he plays his draws.One hand he c/r big with OEFD and put the rest of his stack in on the turn.Another hand he just check/call off his whole stack($700) with flush draw vs mid set on Ac Js 8s flop.
Two early position limpers, a TAG regular($550) in HJ raises $30,villain calls from co,hero calls with 8d 7d in bt. Limpers call.
Flop($150): 7s 2s 7c Limpers check, hj bets $100,villian shoves for $650, hero? His range includes trip 7s,22, overplayed overpairs and a few flush draws.I doubt he can play 22 or bad flush draws this way.
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Old 10-28-2018, 11:28 AM   #2
devnull2
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Re: 2/5 78s flopped trips facing 130bb shove

Easy call, not sure what the question is here.
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Old 10-28-2018, 12:35 PM   #3
twitcherroo
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Re: 2/5 78s flopped trips facing 130bb shove

Yeah, really a snap call for $650. Either an overpair or a flush draw. Would be really unusual for this to be 2's. Would feel better on an A77 flop but whatever, never folding here. If he has it, NH.
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Old 10-28-2018, 01:03 PM   #4
maplestar
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Re: 2/5 78s flopped trips facing 130bb shove

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Originally Posted by devnull2 View Post
Easy call, not sure what the question is here.
This is bad advice.Can you explain why it's an easy call given that he is passive postflop. As I said, he wouldn't play flush draws this way based on my reads.
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Old 10-28-2018, 01:13 PM   #5
johnnyfry2
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Re: 2/5 78s flopped trips facing 130bb shove

Unless you have the nuts, it's never an easy call for 130bb's

I wouldn't put him on 22, but he could have A-7 suited, and knowing he has shown you shoves with draws he is hoping for someone to have a hand just like you have (something many players do to confuse). Is 10-9 of spades a possibility here? Or, as you suggested, a possible flush draw and he believes the fear of him having a seven ensures a high amount of fold equity.

This is one of those read-specific cases. Tough to lay down for sure. What did you do, and do you know what he had?
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Old 10-28-2018, 01:47 PM   #6
devnull2
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Re: 2/5 78s flopped trips facing 130bb shove

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Originally Posted by maplestar View Post
This is bad advice.Can you explain why it's an easy call given that he is passive postflop. As I said, he wouldn't play flush draws this way based on my reads.
Sorry, but there's nothing much more to add here. If you have a live read that he has a better 7, maybe you can fold. It's just variance, if he shows up a with a better 7 here. If you are uncomfortable playing this on a board like this, you should be folding pre.
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Old 10-28-2018, 03:41 PM   #7
maplestar
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Re: 2/5 78s flopped trips facing 130bb shove

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Originally Posted by johnnyfry2 View Post
Unless you have the nuts, it's never an easy call for 130bb's

I wouldn't put him on 22, but he could have A-7 suited, and knowing he has shown you shoves with draws he is hoping for someone to have a hand just like you have (something many players do to confuse). Is 10-9 of spades a possibility here? Or, as you suggested, a possible flush draw and he believes the fear of him having a seven ensures a high amount of fold equity.

This is one of those read-specific cases. Tough to lay down for sure. What did you do, and do you know what he had?
My minimum calling hands here are trip 7s with 10 or better kicker.78 is just below this threshold.Yeah,it a close call for sure.I folded my hand but he did show up with 75s. I think I made a right fold given that how many 7 combos there are in his range.
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Old 10-28-2018, 03:45 PM   #8
maplestar
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Re: 2/5 78s flopped trips facing 130bb shove

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Originally Posted by devnull2 View Post
Sorry, but there's nothing much more to add here. If you have a live read that he has a better 7, maybe you can fold. It's just variance, if he shows up a with a better 7 here. If you are uncomfortable playing this on a board like this, you should be folding pre.
I played 78s ip mainly for straight or flush potential in multiway pot. I'm not going broke for trips bad kicker with players behind facing heat.I don't even think about going broke on flush board if there is serious money involved.
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Old 10-28-2018, 04:17 PM   #9
krilleater
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Re: 2/5 78s flopped trips facing 130bb shove

Drawing a cut-off of a ten kicker here is arbitrary and bizarre — you're almost never going to have it, since I assume you don't play T7s most times. Most of your trip kickers here are going to be 6s, 8s and Aces (assuming you play suited Aces). Do you only call trips with an Ace kicker? For me, this isn't a snap call but it's definitely a call.

Let's assume V doesn't do this with 22 (I think most Villains trap there), and he *does* do it with all his sevens.

You said he plays suited connectors and one-gappers. So he can have 75s, 76s, 78s, and 79s. Let's also give him A7s.

Against that range of exclusively trips, you already have 46%. You have to call 650 to win a $1550 pot, so you need 41%, making this a trivial call especially if you think he could ever be spewing with a bizarre overpair or flush draw.

If you're going to choose a 7 to fold here, 76s is a much better candidate since it blocks his worse kickers and loses to more of his better kickers. With 78s you're only afraid of 79s and A7s.

Against crazy loose players who play all sorts of random 7s, this might be a fold. But that's not your read—I don't think a "semi-loose" regular plays (for example) Q7s with a frequency that you should worry about it.
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Old 10-28-2018, 04:24 PM   #10
maplestar
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Re: 2/5 78s flopped trips facing 130bb shove

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Originally Posted by krilleater View Post
Drawing a cut-off of a ten kicker here is arbitrary and bizarre — you're almost never going to have it, since I assume you don't play T7s most times. Most of your trip kickers here are going to be 6s, 8s and Aces (assuming you play suited Aces). Do you only call trips with an Ace kicker? For me, this isn't a snap call but it's definitely a call.

Let's assume V doesn't do this with 22 (I think most Villains trap there), and he *does* do it with all his sevens.

You said he plays suited connectors and one-gappers. So he can have 75s, 76s, 78s, and 79s. Let's also give him A7s.

Against that range of exclusively trips, you already have 46%. You have to call 650 to win a $1550 pot, so you need 41%, making this a trivial call especially if you think he could ever be spewing with a bizarre overpair or flush draw.

If you're going to choose a 7 to fold here, 76s is a much better candidate since it blocks his worse kickers and loses to more of his better kickers. With 78s you're only afraid of 79s and A7s.

Against crazy loose players who play all sorts of random 7s, this might be a fold. But that's not your read—I don't think a "semi-loose" regular plays (for example) Q7s with a frequency that you should worry about it.
This guy is a loose bad passive player.You cant exclude any other 7s he choose to play in CO.I'd probably call off vs a tighter player.Also,it's very likely that we end up chopping on this board.Risk/reward is no good in this scenario.

Last edited by maplestar; 10-28-2018 at 04:33 PM.
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Old 10-28-2018, 05:50 PM   #11
krilleater
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Re: 2/5 78s flopped trips facing 130bb shove

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Originally Posted by maplestar View Post
This guy is a loose bad passive player.You cant exclude any other 7s he choose to play in CO.I'd probably call off vs a tighter player.Also,it's very likely that we end up chopping on this board.Risk/reward is no good in this scenario.
Okay, you're changing your read now. In OP, you said he was a semi-loose reg (who will play suited one-gappers, but probably not tons of random suited 7s).

Chopping with $250 in dead money is a great result if it ends up happening.

My range analysis didn't include *any* hand besides those with a 7 and that still makes this a call. Add in any draws or overpairs and it's a snap call.
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Old 10-28-2018, 06:42 PM   #12
winadil
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Re: 2/5 78s flopped trips facing 130bb shove

this is really reads based on villian, I think this hand is right on the boarder of call or fold.
anything better I am calling anything worst i am folding.

your read is he not aggressive postflop and your example was the OEFD which does have a lot of equity against most hands, also just calling of his stack off on a flush draw makes me think he is more of a passive calling station postflop when on a weakish draw.
when you consider these fact when these type of people start betting I am more incline to belive them, the board is very dry barring the flush draw but given your example he would be more incline to call rather than pump the pot.

If the flop was a little more connected eg 775ss then I would put a few more random draws in his range and be a little more comfortable calling this off.

I think I should probably call this a little more often than I would like too but given he could do this with some worst hands I think I would sigh call and expect too see some random suited 7x more often than not.

these are the type of hands that can make or break a session.


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Old 10-28-2018, 07:01 PM   #13
krilleater
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Re: 2/5 78s flopped trips facing 130bb shove

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Originally Posted by winadil View Post
this is really reads based on villian, I think this hand is right on the boarder of call or fold.
anything better I am calling anything worst i am folding.
The problem is I doubt OP has many better hands to call with. If he calls suited Kings and suited one-gappers (79) from the button, then this is more borderline. As is, this is one of his best hands to call with.

Quote:
Originally Posted by winadil View Post
your read is he not aggressive postflop and your example was the OEFD which does have a lot of equity against most hands, also just calling of his stack off on a flush draw makes me think he is more of a passive calling station postflop when on a weakish draw.
when you consider these fact when these type of people start betting I am more incline to belive them, the board is very dry barring the flush draw but given your example he would be more incline to call rather than pump the pot.
You don't have to give him any draws to make this a call.
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