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Old 03-25-2014, 05:49 PM   #1
Jume
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2/2 Top two with problems

Hello everyone,

in my first post in this forum i would like to hear some advice on how to proceed with the following hand.

Villain is in SB and has 238$ with hero covering him (~300$). He is around 30yo and I have played with him quite often. He is talented and puts effort in his game. Had already a couple of discussion on how to play in various other spots, so history is pretty much given.

Other Players involved:

BB: Unknown, but was almost busto (some very weird action, definitive fish) and left table to get called back for his remaining 12$ -> sat down and put 2$ in and 10$ in hand
UTG 1 (15$ left): younger guy tight/passive and did not play very well
UTG 3 (~100$): guy around 40s and very passive aswell
HERO (MP2)($~300): Hand was played last week and I am 3-5 times a week in the casino and should have a TAG image. On this particular evening i stacked of someone with AK vs TT for ~100 and haven't played much more since
CU (100$): Unknown younger guy, seemed to be first time in a casino - kinda nervous and his first hand


Hero dealt AQ

Preflop ($4) folds to UTG+1/2 who limped in with HERO in MP2 limping aswell to the CU who puts in 2$ (looked like he thought that he is supposed to pay in his first round) with the sb checking to the BB who looks in his hand to the remaining 10$ chip and checks aswell.

Flop ($12) A58
All check to HERO who checked aswell with CU quickly checking behind

Note: In reevaluation this was a big mistake, but i feld to comfortable with almost nuts in my hand!


Turn ($12) Q

Cant image a better card not giving the flush. But the second the turn come out the bb mumbled something which induced a quick check of the SB.
BB puts in his remaining 10$, UTG sighed and puts his remaining 15$ in with UTG3 folding.
Hero raised it to 30$
CU folds
SB raise to 64$

I absolutely did not thought about facing a raise in this hand from the SB and
instantly thought about 55/88 which sneaky induced a bet on the flop from someone as this hits the range of at least 1 limper almost always. Still, i have 13 Outs for the nuts on the river and cant see a reason to give up here. The pot is protected so he has never ever a bluff in his range like myself. With special regard to this we are facing a made hand which can only be A8/A5 (unlikely that he will broke this), AQ, 55, 88 or 67 (but strongly doubt this since he will go to showdown and 7 high cant win something)

Hero calls 64$

River ($165) T

SB tanks for 20seconds (has already his remaining 172$ stacked since i asked him how much he played) and puts in 98$.
I was prepared to face another bet from the SB since he is in value town and Hero did not improve to the nuts. Interesting betsize which suggest a value bet.

Hero calls 98$


Note: General my preflop- idea was to isoraise the shove from the bb with dead money in it to easily take the remaining money away from him.

Questions:

Postflop: How bad is it to give away a free card when hitting such a nice flop
Turn: Do we rather call it down or shove it
River: after actions on turn it was obvious that we will face a bet - still good for us, since the river don't improve much (Besides kj)



Shall I post the outcome instantly?
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Old 03-25-2014, 08:40 PM   #2
atsuss33
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Re: 2/2 Top two with problems

I would've raised pre-flop. I don't see any reason in raising the turn. You have top 2 w/ the nut flush draw. You want more players in the hand. As played, I snap call. SB could easily have a worse 2 pair than you. Doubtful he has KJ since he re-raised you OTT. Like I said, I'm snap calling, then kicking myself when he turns over a worse 2 pair.
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Old 03-25-2014, 08:57 PM   #3
wck117
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Re: 2/2 Top two with problems

This hand is poorly played. Raise pre, bet flop, don't min raise turn, pretty ugly all around.
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Old 03-25-2014, 09:17 PM   #4
venice10
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Re: 2/2 Top two with problems

My suggestion is to wait 24 hours before posting the results.

As played, pf is a raise all the time. You have a very good hand pf and want to have the ability to win the hand cbetting the flop if you miss against 1 opponent. Flop is a bet 100% of the time. You'll get any Ax to call and you have a good draw to the nuts.

I'd bet more on the turn. After the raise, it becomes read dependent. Obviously, you respect his play, but you've played this hand so bad I'm not sure how good the villain is. If he was good, he'd bet this flop with a set or two pair, expecting all Axs and FDs chasing. A bad player will also bet, but only because they would hate having a FD hit. A mediocre player is going to check this wanting to trap with a "big hand." I'm inclined to call the turn overall.

River is giving us about 3:1. There's just no bluff in his range. That said, unless it is only a set played this way, you call. I can see a mediocre villain playing 2 pair this way, so you call.
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Old 03-25-2014, 09:57 PM   #5
Jume
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Re: 2/2 Top two with problems

Thanks for the suggestions so far.
I totally agree that the hand was missplayed in some way!

Just want to stretch out that the bb with all his behaviour made clear that he will put his money in no matter which hand he got - bummer he waits until the turn comes along! That changed the dynamic of the hand completely with my preflop intention to raise it afterwards!

Villain is definately a good player on that level and I would like to know whether i can shove or raise the turn or not which would avoid an ugly river decicion
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Old 03-25-2014, 10:00 PM   #6
jDiDo
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Your hand is really underrepped and villain could be value betting a lot of worse 2pairs
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Old 03-25-2014, 10:08 PM   #7
Dirty313
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Re: 2/2 Top two with problems

raise prefop 11-13 depending on table with 1 limper

then bet flop
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Old 03-25-2014, 10:15 PM   #8
Lapidator
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The only problem I'd have with this hand would be concealing my massive hard on.
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Old 03-25-2014, 11:30 PM   #9
bananapeel
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Re: 2/2 Top two with problems

raise pre it solves all the problems!
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Old 03-26-2014, 09:51 AM   #10
Jume
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Re: 2/2 Top two with problems

It seems like I am the only one really considering a stronger hand than mine, especially with my decision on the turn just to call his raise.

In my opinion there is just 55/88 which troubles me a lot, but I want someone to pay with a hand worse than mine and I cant see any! So I would hang myself for a turn shove (if we exlude AQ for a split) here unless we have the case that he is willing to broke A8 or A5. And I can ensure that he won't do that vs. me
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Old 03-26-2014, 10:20 AM   #11
Lapidator
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Re: 2/2 Top two with problems

Jume,

You have Top Pair 2nd Kicker plus a Nut Flush Draw. TP2K+NFD. A very strong hand.

You're focused on only the very top of your villain's range, which is currently beating you. This is called Monster Under the Bed Syndrome. You are afraid of the dark, even if there's nothing there.

I would be trying to get all in on the flop.

Welcome to the forums. I suggest you read all the threads included in the stickies at the top.
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Old 03-26-2014, 01:54 PM   #12
Jume
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Re: 2/2 Top two with problems

Well, okay.
It seems like I credit the top range to much in those spots.

So the results are:

BB instantly mucks
UTG1 flips over KJos for a straight
SB shows AQos and ties the main pot with HERO


Well this is basically the top range of villain and i could not see any other hand (besides 55/88) which comes to the showdown here!
So I had a freeroll on the river but still would like to argue whether a turn shove would be profitable or not.
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Old 03-26-2014, 03:51 PM   #13
bananapeel
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Re: 2/2 Top two with problems

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jume View Post
So I had a freeroll on the river but still would like to argue whether a turn shove would be profitable or not.
The way the hand played out, its profitable 'all day loooooong' as we say

Welcome BTW
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