9 handed
100BB (1 short, 7 bigger, up to about 800BB)
10 10 utg, on this table I really am unsure of how to play in this spot, I raise 5x
fold, fold, 3bet to 15x, fold, call, fold, fold BB calls, I call..

Flop comes A7J rainbow..
BB checks, I check, MP checks and Mp2 2/3 pots it, BB calls.. I fold

For info on sd neither player had an A, the board was dry till the end also, forget what they had, like a mid pair vs 2 pair (didn't flop) if I recall.. knew they were spewy but hadnt observed to many player specifics at that point.
So I am a bit unsure in this hand what to do.. I effectivley have about 8BBs if the prf aggresion is continued so could be an argument for 4bet shoving prf? Really not sure.

5x seems like a really big open.

Standard fold on flop, not sure what you're asking.

less than 5x is treated like a limp at the table really.. and people do open crazy big, like 8x-12x.. If it's standard fold on flop then doesn't it seem somewhat unprofitable to play 1010 UTG? I asked question at the end of post, more just how to play correctly really.

Flop is definitely a fold.

Preflop you're getting 3.5:1 OOP and you're flipping at best. You're basically setmining here. I would probably just fold pre-flop.

Fold to the 3b?
It's tricky because these crazy raises and opens don't happen every hand..

I don't really get this logic.

Like, you expect to get 3bet a large % of the time, and then when you call, you expect the flop to be this bad the majority of the time?

That's like saying, wow I got into a big traffic jam this one time I drove I car, and it would've been quicker if I just took the subway or walked or wahtever, looks like driving a car is super unrprofitable.

Ok so if he 3bet to say.. 20x with 3 callers, are we flatting that? can we 4bet shove, can we fold? the size is more important here than the frequency imo, I know it's gonna be high, they have no appreciation of how tight my UTG open range is gonna be, they just wanna gamble. but vs 4 players i have about 28% equity, I'm just trying to put this together in a coherent way.. I have an extremely low SPR so I don't think set mining can be profitible anyway, though maybe multiway makes it so? I don't know and can't find the info to help me.

It just... depends on so many things, starting with what their range is. No you can't set mine, but like, folding on f cking AJ7 rainbow doesn't mean you're folding whenever you don't flop a set, that's a huge leap of logic coming from nowhere. How does you having to fold on one of the worst boards to be facing a cbet on have anything to do with whether you can play your hand profitably?

And how can the size matter more than the frequency? If you're doing okay vs their range then you should be calling vs any size, as long as you can realise that equity.

lemme try and explain my thinking..
Firstly I'm not talking about folding flop if I don't hit set, I was asking a possibly rhetorical question about playing 1010 utg vs maniacs.. how to correctly do it. In another thread I posted when I described the dynamics of this game, people were suggesting that my 100BB stack is effectively a lot shorter due to large open/raise sizings, and that I could play in a more ss approach.
I don't understand you saying sizing doesn't matter you call if you are ahead of range.. surely we can't be far away from where 4bet shoving makes more sense? When I worked out equity I gave him and callers around 20% which I think is fairly accurate.. Idk if I mentioned but they all had massive stacks compared to my 100BB.

Yeah 4betting CAN make sense, but I wasn't responding to that, I'm responding to you saying sizing matters more than frequency, which is blatantly not true.

The thing is overcallers will very often flat with hands like QQ JJ even KK AA, which makes jamming very unattractive, but, yeah due to the SPR jamming would be good if you think their ranges are light and that they'd 4b the weaker hands, and the 3b itself is light. Simple maths, like literally just give them a range, apply a frequency to those range, then do an EV calc on how often they fold, and what EV that is, how often v 1, v2, v3 calls, and what EV that gives you, and so on and so forth. Basic BASIC maths.

You can call to find a flop with no overcard to stack off on, that's an option if you think they are loose enough (but not loose enough to just jam, or they might be so loose that they'd call off AQ AJ vs you). Where does this idea that if you have enough equity you should therefore jam come from? You might have enough equity against their ranges now, but be behind against their call range, as is likely the case here.

I think theres various points were both addressing. I meant for the argument I was making size here was the issue, I think I already said he was 3bing light. These guys weren't flatting those hands I gotta think, from what I'd seen. You lost me a bit with the basic maths bit I possibly cant work out how 4 ranges effect each others ev.. is there a name for this calculation so I can read more?

I don't mind limping in if the table is as aggro as you say preflop, wait for someone to raise, then do a large 3bet myself, folding to any shove or large 4bet.
You're correct in that thinking, you don't want to see a flop with 3 or 4 players with 10's. If you do, you're just setmining and try to get in for the cost of the blinds.

I'd like to know if the guy that 3bet you is a maniac or not, and if he is, 4bet or shove for value. Especially your stack size makes that an easy decision.
Another factor is if a tight nit who has folded the last 30 hands called the $15 or not.

Fold flop standard, maniacs can always turn over nothing to taunt you after you fold...that's standard too lol

What stake is this?

Thanks for the posts, think I have the play figured out now.

10/10