1/3NL: Weird Spot with AQcc - Live Low-stakes No Limit Poker Forum

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1/3NL: Weird Spot with AQcc

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01-02-2018 , 10:16 AM

TPTK77

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 2,438

First Orbit. No Reads, but seems like a standard 1/3NL game. People look to be loose preflop and more like calling stations instead of raising.

OTTH:

UTG+1 limps, MP and HJ overlimp, CO raises to $15, BTN calls, Hero in SB w/ AQcc calls, UTG+1 and MP call, HJ raises to $100, CO folds, BTN calls, and Hero ????

Hero has $300 and CO, BTN both cover w/ ~$500.

Super weird back raise by HJ but since I called the $15 raise, I can't really have anything either.

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01-02-2018 , 10:39 AM

Machiavelli999

enthusiast

Join Date: Dec 2017 Posts: 57

$100 preflop raise and two calls?? This is not a standard 1/3NL game

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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01-02-2018 , 10:39 AM

NewClintEastwood

centurion

Join Date: Dec 2017 Posts: 166

Definitely an odd game. I fold and play lockdown poker while I figure out WTF is going on at this table

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01-02-2018 , 10:54 AM

Nogyong

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Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 2,801

Fold.

The limp-raise looks like JJ/AK+.

Maybe button or cutoff had been raising lots preflop.

In any case without having a better idea for the table dynamic, the pot is too large relative to our stack size for us to consider continuing in the hand.

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01-02-2018 , 12:53 PM

setintostraight

adept

Join Date: Sep 2017 Posts: 884

Quote:

The limp-raise looks like JJ/AK+.

KK+ at 1/3. That's exactly how I used to play it half the time in 2017 when just starting to learn poker. Even the sizing is exactly what I would make it.

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01-02-2018 , 01:20 PM

ZuneIt

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Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 2,160

1st orbit + no reads = fold, although AQs gets mucked anyways.

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01-02-2018 , 03:20 PM

TPTK77

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Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 2,438

Are we only ranging HJ on JJ+/AK here? Why would he over limp with 2 limpers ahead?

I agree that maybe if the BTN is loose and has been raising, but that one seems fishy too.

If we shove do we have Fold Equity here?

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01-02-2018 , 03:23 PM

Javanewt

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Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 12,781

Is this the first orbit for everyone or your first orbit at the table?

I would have 3bet the first time.

As played, just fold and, as posted, figure out what is going on.

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01-02-2018 , 03:32 PM

TPTK77

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Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 2,438

Quote:

Originally Posted by Javanewt

Is this the first orbit for everyone or your first orbit at the table?

I would have 3bet the first time.

As played, just fold and, as posted, figure out what is going on.

Just my first orbit at the table.

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01-02-2018 , 03:38 PM

#10

johnnyBuz

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Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 7,563

3! pre. Your relative position is too poor to flat.

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01-02-2018 , 04:56 PM

#11

TPTK77

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Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 2,438

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnnyBuz

3! pre. Your relative position is too poor to flat.

Okay so as played fold but do you think there is any merit to shoving?

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01-02-2018 , 05:16 PM

#12

Javanewt

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Quote:

Originally Posted by TPTK77

Okay so as played fold but do you think there is any merit to shoving?

I know you asked johnny, but personally, I see no point in shoving w/o info on the other players.

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01-02-2018 , 05:18 PM

#13

Playbig2000

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Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 11,349

I would much rather squeeze pre, the only prob is we're a little shallow with only 100 big blinds, otherwise I would 3bet to 75. If we do and cbet, we're pretty much committed with no room to maneuver so flatting pre is a second option.

as played snap fold now.

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01-02-2018 , 06:23 PM

#14

johnnyBuz

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Javanewt

I know you asked johnny, but personally, I see no point in shoving w/o info on the other players.

Pretty much. OP, if you want advice other than 'fold' you have to give us some kind of read, however minimal it may be. Physical reads (age, gender, nationality) and body language go a long way here.

I'm tempted to rip it for $300 cuz of CO/BTN dead $$ and we're only 100 BB's effective and we should be flipping often enough, but HJ probably just has KK here and folding is fine.

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01-02-2018 , 06:50 PM

#15

Nozsr

old hand

Join Date: Dec 2013 Posts: 1,722

IME we are up against AK in the HJ here more often than not.

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01-02-2018 , 06:54 PM

#16

Nogyong

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Quote:

Originally Posted by TPTK77

If we shove do we have Fold Equity here?

No. After they put a 5th of their stack in, we don't have much fold equity.

If you think HJ's limp-raise looks suspicious imagine how weak hero's sb shove is going to look.

Of course, it would be great if they both have weak hands and we can get HJ to fold so that we're at least only up against button. Or if we could get the chips in against two pocket pairs lower than QQ.

The real problem is that HJ's range is weighted towards AA/AK. They are unlucky to have a weak Ax hand.

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01-02-2018 , 07:38 PM

#17

Chicagodude

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Join Date: Feb 2013 Posts: 2,810

Auto fold, AQ is dominated all too often here and you're left praying for clubs.

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01-02-2018 , 08:03 PM

#18

DMag

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Join Date: Apr 2017 Posts: 38

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnnyBuz

Since we're likely never getting a fold here wouldn't it be better to just flat and call down any A, Q, or two club flops?

As for the strange limp raise I'm not sure you can just put him on JJ+/AK. I've seen people spaz out and try to take it down with any pocket pair with a bunch of flats and a lot of dead money in the pot.
------------------
Also agree with those saying to 3bet here the first time around.

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01-02-2018 , 11:23 PM

#19

SwolyswoND

old hand

Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 1,976

No idea how you guys are putting V on JJ+/AK. He overlimped after TWO limpers and then backraised. Way more likely V has 88-JJ than the range being assigned ITT.

AP, can't call the 3! (and 3! yourself pre the first time around) - if there's reads that V has a fold button then I jam here because we're usually flipping if called, if not, just fold.

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01-03-2018 , 06:24 AM

#20

Nogyong

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Quote:

Originally Posted by SwolyswoND

No idea how you guys are putting V on JJ+/AK. He overlimped after TWO limpers and then backraised. Way more likely V has 88-JJ than the range being assigned ITT.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SwolyswoND

if there's reads that V has a fold button then I jam here because we're usually flipping if called, if not, just fold.

This is the first orbit. No reads. Two villains just committed a fifth of their stacks. We've invested 5bb in this hand so far.

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01-03-2018 , 10:40 AM

#21

Javanewt

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Quote:

Originally Posted by SwolyswoND

No idea how you guys are putting V on JJ+/AK. He overlimped after TWO limpers and then backraised. Way more likely V has 88-JJ than the range being assigned ITT.

What if we find out that CO and/or BTN raises every hand limped to them and HJ was just waiting for a good hand to limp/3bet? W/o reads, I'm more inclined to put HJ on a big hand rather than a small one -- and I'm definitely not shoving AQs vs. an unknown 3bettor.

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01-03-2018 , 11:10 AM

#22

SwolyswoND

old hand

Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 1,976

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nogyong

This is the first orbit. No reads. Two villains just committed a fifth of their stacks. We've invested 5bb in this hand so far.

As I said, I'm folding absent a read that V has a fold button, but his range is most certainly wider than JJ+/AK here.

Also, the fact that we've "invested" 5bb so far is utterly meaningless.

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01-03-2018 , 02:47 PM

#23

Nogyong

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Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 2,801

Quote:

Originally Posted by SwolyswoND

As I said, I'm folding absent a read that V has a fold button,

Quote:

Originally Posted by TPTK77

First Orbit. No Reads, .

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Originally Posted by SwolyswoND

Also, the fact that we've "invested" 5bb so far is utterly meaningless.

True. Fair point.

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01-03-2018 , 03:03 PM

#24

sai1b0ats

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Join Date: Feb 2017 Posts: 2,463

All action choices have merit the first time around, given your lack of reads. The second time around is an easy fold. You don't know if you've got one or more maniacs on your hands or a nit with a station. Readless claims that this action looks like 88-JJ are nonsense.

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