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1/3: River hidden straight vs aggro fish, best line? 1/3: River hidden straight vs aggro fish, best line?

05-26-2018 , 12:28 PM
Okay so I river a disguised straight in a limped pot in this hand and not sure whether I should be leading or checking river.. a brief history of V2 (aggrofish in hand) who’s dwindled his stack from 800 to 250 in 20 mins bluffing off a few hands.

1) H (300) opened 15 TT UTG, 3 calls (300ish stacks), V (800) raised 50 OTB, H called, UTG1 shoved 400, folded to V who mucked AK face up. H folded too. This was when things started going downhill for V2.

2) H (300) opened KJdd UTG 7-handed, V called in SB. Flop (34): Ks9d8h.. V check/called 15. Turn (64): Ac.. V leads 35, H calls. River (134): Ad.. V leads 100, H calls. V shows 74ss.

3) Another hand he played against someone he bet/called a c/r OTT with the NFD and then shoved river when he whiffed and got looked up by AKo for TPTK. He lost over $450 in that hand.

OTTH...

V1 (500, seemingly decent player but limps a lot) limps UTG, 2 other limps, V2 (300) limps OTB, Hero (400) checks 53o in BB.

Flop (15): AT4hhc
Checks around

Turn (15): 7c
Hero bets 15, V1 calls, V2 calls

River (60): 2s
Hero ??

With the action so far, it seems their ranges are capped at Tx and include a bunch of straight and flush draws. Do we still bet river to get a Hero call or some slowplayed Ax? Or is it better to check and let V2 blast off here?

Would obviously hate to let it check through but it also seems impossible that they’d have many value hands that will pay off.
1/3: River hidden straight vs aggro fish, best line? Quote
05-26-2018 , 12:54 PM
I would continue with the aggression and either bet small enough that it gets called 90% of the time or overbet a little for value (expecting folds 1/2 the time or more)
1/3: River hidden straight vs aggro fish, best line? Quote
05-26-2018 , 01:32 PM
Grunch
I think he's probably a bit of sick of having his bluffs called and won't try it this time, lets see if his tilt can embody itself as a station rather than a blaster, let him be the one hero calling rather than getting hero'd - bet 100.
1/3: River hidden straight vs aggro fish, best line? Quote
05-26-2018 , 03:22 PM
I prefer betting $35 over a check. HU, checking to V2 probably better.
1/3: River hidden straight vs aggro fish, best line? Quote
05-26-2018 , 04:45 PM
Probably not that likely to bluff 3 way and if he does you get what 30 bucks? He's not going to bluff/call a x/r. Just bet like 40 and hope someone calls IMO.
1/3: River hidden straight vs aggro fish, best line? Quote
05-26-2018 , 05:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rebus
Grunch
I think he's probably a bit of sick of having his bluffs called and won't try it this time, lets see if his tilt can embody itself as a station rather than a blaster, let him be the one hero calling rather than getting hero'd - bet 100.
Depending on what weight you assign missed draws in V2's range, I like checking to induce a little more than the overbet, but prefer overbet to rep a missed draw much more than 1/2 pot. Could also depend on your image and play, which you didn't give info on.
1/3: River hidden straight vs aggro fish, best line? Quote
05-28-2018 , 12:12 PM
I'm cool with preflop.

Even though it's for lol $$$, I'd still bet less on the turn. Very good chance no one has an Ace and perhaps even a T given this turn action, but there's no difference in calling frequency between like a $10 bet and a $15 bet, so I bet less to give myself better odds with my double gutshot just in case I'm called.

Think you could argue all plays on the river. I might go inbetween and bet a small weakish looking amount (like $20). This might get looked up by one pair (so we don't miss value by hands that check behind), and might also still get V2 to play back at us if V1 folds. I think it's the best of all worlds, especially in a 3way pot where V2 might not bluff as much.

GcluelessNLnoobG
1/3: River hidden straight vs aggro fish, best line? Quote
05-28-2018 , 12:27 PM
I don't like the turn bet at all, check the turn. You don't need to burn $15 with trash equity when you've involuntarily invested $2 into this pot.

River is an obvious bet imo, it's going to check through way too often. Prefer a smallish size.
1/3: River hidden straight vs aggro fish, best line? Quote
05-28-2018 , 12:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Calldown88
I don't like the turn bet at all, check the turn. You don't need to burn $15 with trash equity when you've involuntarily invested $2 into this pot.
I like betting the turn (although I'd bet less). Anyone with an Ace is betting this drawy board, and LP will often bet with a pair on this type of board if checked to. Flush draws will also often bet. So there's fairly good indication that no one has much of anything. On top of that we have a double gutshot (so it's not as if we are doing this with no equity whatsoever).

GcluelessNLnoobG
1/3: River hidden straight vs aggro fish, best line? Quote
05-28-2018 , 01:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gobbledygeek
I like betting the turn (although I'd bet less). Anyone with an Ace is betting this drawy board, and LP will often bet with a pair on this type of board if checked to. Flush draws will also often bet. So there's fairly good indication that no one has much of anything. On top of that we have a double gutshot (so it's not as if we are doing this with no equity whatsoever).

GcluelessNLnoobG
Think this is the first time you've ever liked a bet when I didn't. I actually think any bet with 35o in this spot is pretty terrible given that we've invested nothing into this pot and now we're putting in $15 trying to make 4 other players fold.

Whether or not a flush draw would bet...like why would you bet a middle flush draw? This isn't heads up where that'd make sense, this is 5 way where you simply have too many people who need to fold. Nut flush draw I could get behind, others I wouldn't expect to bet. I wouldn't bet weak Ax on this board either, you just get owned by better Ax, or get called by draws that still have high equity.
1/3: River hidden straight vs aggro fish, best line? Quote
05-28-2018 , 02:16 PM
I mean, in this spot we ended up getting called in 2 spots, so what do I know about no one having anything. But I don't think it's a terrible spot to semi-bluff given this information, plus being able to set our own price (I would have set a better price). And on top of that it improves our metagame in that we're not just always the nit betting the nuts on the turn.

Git'slikelyclose,buthardlyhorrible?G
1/3: River hidden straight vs aggro fish, best line? Quote
05-28-2018 , 11:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gobbledygeek
I mean, in this spot we ended up getting called in 2 spots, so what do I know about no one having anything. But I don't think it's a terrible spot to semi-bluff given this information, plus being able to set our own price (I would have set a better price). And on top of that it improves our metagame in that we're not just always the nit betting the nuts on the turn.

Git'slikelyclose,buthardlyhorrible?G
It's actually a pretty bad spot to bluff IMO given 2 of our 8 straight outs make flushes. More than that there are up to 90 flush draws, 32 OESDs, many gutshots, and who knows how many AX and TX combos that call. Yeah it got checked around on the flop but that doesn't mean much. Checking a weak Ace is not at all unusual in a limped multiway pot. I just don't expect a bluff to get through 4 players on a board this wet very often at all. We have some equity when called but not that much. 6 clean outs only 3 of which give us the nuts. And what's the plan if we get called and brick? Just x/f? Fire again?

I'm all for not being the nit but there are much better spots to bluff than limped 5-way pots with a zillion draws and AX that are never folding.
1/3: River hidden straight vs aggro fish, best line? Quote
05-29-2018 , 11:27 AM
I overbet this river given FD hearts missed and hope to get called by Ax or 2 pair. I think I bet $70
1/3: River hidden straight vs aggro fish, best line? Quote
06-02-2018 , 10:10 AM
Definitely should be betting a weak Ax on this turn with this action like 99% of the time.
1/3: River hidden straight vs aggro fish, best line? Quote

      
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