Hand happened last night
$1/3 NL


Hero ($252) has been playing TAG but been completely card dead for about 2 hours only playing 2 hands. Won one lost the other neither went to showdown. My image may be nitty at this point but I only think one villain (V1) at the table even recognizes this.

V1 (~$550) is a solid reg MABG. have played with him a few times before and he never gets out of line. Plays TAG but recognizes when he can squeeze. Overall solid.

V2 (~$330) LAG if not close to maniac older asian gentleman perhaps early 40s. Previously went all in preflop earlier this session with A5s and A9o. Has already bought back in. Like to gamble from what I can tell this session so have been looking for opportunities to take advantage of this. Has not perception of bet sizing or position.

OTTH

UTG limps, UTG+1 V1 raises to $15 one caller in MP and we look down at 22 on the BTN.

At this point V2 has been playing a lot of pots VPIP probably around 80% so I elect to call thinking he will as well. V2 than min-raise 3b to $30. V1 calls, MP folds, I call.

Pot $108
Flop : 742
V2 tanks for 10 seconds or so than bets $65. I almost exclusively put him on an over pair at this point. He has no concept of 3b sizing or position and I saw him play two hands fairly similar this session. V1 tanks for a long time, 30s or so than makes the call. His open than call make me think he is on a FD. I feel like if he had a stronger holding than JJ he might have 4b with so many people in the hand preflop after V2 min raise. I see this as AKs, KQs, KJs. He also could have other overpairs that want to see a turn 88-JJ. Perhaps even flopped a set but we probably go broke against that anyway

Pot is $278. Hero?

Obvious shove is obvious.

^This. Dream scenario. You can't worry about the 1/100 chance of set over set.

I'm ~ok with the initial call as it is for an ~ok price and it'll most likely go multiway enough to enable us to get to our IO easily enough especially in position. Having said that, I also don't think it's a crime to fold small pairs, which have some decent RIO at some tables, but obviously that is super nitty. Getting 6:1 I think we're forced to sigh call the min 3bet closing the action and in position.

I believe pot is more like $238, but still we only have $222 left (so just < PSB). Against a maniac who is 3betting and continuing I probably just hope for the best and shove now before a scare card comes. The other option is to flat and get it all in on the turn but it is riskier.

GcluelessNLnoobG

Easiest shove in the world.

Add me to the shove chorus.

Ok I dont think I need to wait for more replies. I did end up shoving, V2 called and V1 tanked for what was about a minute before folding. Just was wondering if there was any merit to calling allowing worse hands to call another bet

I think anything other than a shove is FPS and over thinking the hand.

If board didn't contain the flush draw I'd lean more to flatting.

GcluelessNLnoobG

Pre is a fold

Yeah flop you should shove. Don't get cute at 1/3.

I'm pretty new myself but it seems calling PF with small pairs, just to set mine, is a losing play too. Something to consider.

Yeah not sure why you're worried here. Do you want to call and see another spade? A fish has said that he likes his hand. For sure he's going to continue. Other guy might get priced in for a draw, or continue with the over pair.

Shove is the only right play here, given your stack size relative to the pot.
Never worry about set/over set. It doesn't happen often enough.

Now lets talk PF.... that's more interesting. The chance to hit a set is 1 in 8. 1/8th of your stack is $31.50. So the thirty dollar call will pay itself off if you get stacks in good every single time you hit the set.
You've got two players who like their hands, to get paid from. So chance of stacking someone is very high. You might even triple up. Minus the times you get sucked out on, or don't get stacks in. I think its a marginal call pre-flop. Maybe having the button makes it ok.... occasionally you'll be able to take the pot down when they both check the flop with hands like AK.

Calling $30 pre just to set mine would be a mistake, but calling $15 is not a set-mining mistake in either case. General rule of thumb is that we want 15:1 IOs to set mine HU.

For the open, we are getting 16.8:1, have position, and have a good chance of getting a high IO gambloor to come along and make things even better. This would only be a mistake if we expect V2 to often squeeze and force us out.

After the min-raise, we are closing the action, and are getting Direct Odds of 5:1 plus IOs of 15.8:1 from two players,* one of whom is a near maniac. It is an even more clear call than the first time.



*This is not the same as 31.6:1, as you'll very rarely get both of them to get stacks in, but it is far better than the same IOs from just one player.