Villain (EP): MAWG, tilting hard after dumping most of $1500 stack. Violently threw cards into muck while mumbling after his river bluff got called. ($500)
Hero (HJ): late 20s Asian guy, TAG winning image (covers)

Four limpers including villain. Hero makes it $23 in the HJ with AT. SB calls, villain calls.

Flop: QT7 ($76)

Checked around.

Turn: 5 ($76)

SB checks. Villain bets $45. Hero calls, SB folds.

River: 5 ($166)

Villain checks. Hero studies villain and villain is glaring angrily at hero. Hero ???

It's hard to bluff (or turn hands into bluffs) against tilted people. They're not folding, I would just check it back. You would be kicking yourself if he check raises you.

Bet the flop. Solves a lot of problems in this hand and gives a much better idea of where even a tilty player is range wise.

I think I b/f this river for value, although it is close. Hard to tell what Tilty V will call down with so I suppose checking behind could make some sense.

However, i would have bet the flop/likely checked back the turn (with our increased equity) and then bet the river for value all the time if checked to again. You are in a guessing game now because you let V take the lead.

huh?

just check it back. it looks like V is on the same flush draw that you are and didn't get there. but if you bet, what is V going to call you with? a ten or a seven? those are the only two pairs that you can beat.

I've come around to thinking this should mostly be an overlimp preflop here unless we're really expecting to take it down / get it HU. I just think after 4 limpers this ain't going to happen nearly enough (especially at my loose tables), we're fairly early (still almost half the table to react behind us, two of whom have position), we run into a passively played dominating hand a decent amount, etc. Fewer limpers / later position, ok. Here, it's dicey (noting that I once auto-raised here but I'm now reconsidering this, which is kinda reverting to HOC concepts which I always thought were too tight/nitty but now think might be just fine).

Kinda surprised this didn't go very multiway after a call out of the blinds.

I think I mostly bet the flop here. Our hand could be best (and it is quite vulnerable if it is), it can definitely be called by worse, and we can give ourselves options on the turn. I'd go up to 1/2 PSB and go from there. ETA: As shorn says, it does make later streets much easier in this case (so long as we're not expecting a flop check/raise a decent amount of time).

Against a tilting villain I guess I call the turn. Our IO on our 4-to-a-flush should suck. We're not sure if a A/T is good (and has some RIO). But this guy has shown to be bluffy and might be donking the scare card, so I'm not sure we can give up yet.

I check back the river. There's some argument for a value bet as we beat all Tx hands that might call a small bet, but I think we mostly just get called by better plus risk the chance of this guy making a tiltly bluff raise (and how comfortable do we feel with calling that). And he's never folding better.

GcluelessNLnoobG

You have a great kicker, maybe the best possible card with Ac. Tilty vill will give you action, so bet flop since you are probably ahead and this pot is already worth winning. You can make aces up, runner nut flush, trips, full house, and be ready to stack off if you improve. As played, check river because you do not want action any longer, you want showdown.

Bet something really small, like $20.

It definitely would be a bet for thin value if it wasn't obvious already. Never bluffing this tilt monkey in any pot > $50.

Checked flop cause I can continue on many turns and it gives the tilt monkey rope. I would bet tiny like Avaritia said but I feel like that can induce a x/r to $120. But I would probably have to call it off.

I'm not sure if the angry glare is a tell. Usually a sign of weakness but he had been sitting there looking like he wants to murder someone for quite some time. Real question is does he have enough Tx that will call a decent size bet like 1/2 pot?

EDIT:

I should probably mention that I triple barreled AA vs him on K94 5 Q and got snapped by KJ earlier. The river bet decently sized too. He was already quite tilty at that point.

Against ABC opponents who are never check/raising worse, I'd be cool with that. Are we cool with opening up the check/raising door against this guy? Or is that actually your intention?

GcluelessNLnoobG

Right but realize AA is ok (still thin) here as a triple bc you dont block KJ/KT/QJ

Here you unblock Qx and block the one pair you want to get called by which is Tx.

Its not my intention. My intention is to get tilt called by K high and snap called by Tx.

Most arent capable of river x/r for value so I'd strongly consider calling if he did. Timing etc would come into play.

Ok, that's fair enough. Value bets like this do add up to - that's like an ~hour's worth of work.

GcluelessvaluebettingnoobG

Yea, limon talked about this a long time ago and if you follow pg&c's benabadbeat calls these "coffee bets"

Basically there are times where bena bets $5 into $300 pots lol. And he is probably the best player that still contributes to these forums.

We in llsnl are trapped in the basic thinking of "well of he calls $80 50% of the time and $40 100% of the time I'm indifferent"

But really its $80 5% of the time and $20 100% of the time.

It doesnt mean to always value bet small, thats another leak. But pick your spots.

Yeah, I did two of these last night; very small river bets with relatively small hands (< TP) looking to target very small hands that there was a good chance my opponent held. But they were also against extremely straightforward opponents who would never ever dream of exploiting that bet size (I'm still a little unclear on what this Villain here is about).

GbutIdon'tdrinkcoffee,so?G

Pre standard. Post depends, I lean bet for value. Definitely call turn AP. Maybe 60 otr, but more might be better. (For value obv)

Pre is definitely not standard from the HJ. Def std otb, CO is whatever.

Flop super std, WP. Same for turn.

Otr i bet 40-60% pot and expect to be good very often against a bunch of hero calls