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1/3 flop OESFD 1/3 flop OESFD

07-15-2015 , 01:34 PM
W/e...

I'll overplay the hell out of my hands when V's range includes enough hands that I beat, and V is happy to pay up.

Take the max+EV line, above all else.
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07-15-2015 , 01:42 PM
Wow,

Raise folding river is a very profitable at low limits. Not raising this river is foolish. People hate to fold!!!

Probably have to fold to his 3 bet though.

OP, too many of your post don't have reads on villain. Think it could be a flaw in your game.
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07-15-2015 , 02:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikko
Wow,

Raise folding river is a very profitable at low limits. Not raising this river is foolish. People hate to fold!!!

Probably have to fold to his 3 bet though.

OP, too many of your post don't have reads on villain. Think it could be a flaw in your game.
This guy literally is a rando,

But thanks I will make a note of it
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07-15-2015 , 02:24 PM
Really need a read of some kind on V to put him on a range.

I would call because I don't think he's x/c otf with two pair or a set, x/x the turn with a boat, then x/r the river with the nuts. It's just too weird and passive of a line unless he has a specific read on you as someone who is going to overplay your hand.
1/3 flop OESFD Quote
07-15-2015 , 04:01 PM
total random has you crushed here, only a select handful of players are able to 3bet rivers as a bluff. doubt he's 3betting for value the Qhigh flush.

also for future reference, you flopped a combo draw.
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07-16-2015 , 01:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lapidator
W/e...

I'll overplay the hell out of my hands when V's range includes enough hands that I beat, and V is happy to pay up.

Take the max+EV line, above all else.
Happy to pay up? Most of the Villains in these threads play very well. Usually they're ahead pre-flop/flop/turn/river and get good value with their hands.

But the point is you don't know his range. You probably have never seen the Villain in your entire life.

It seems like whenever Hero has a straight/flush all the Villains turn into donkeys who will bet/call with any two cards and never ever bluff.

A bunch of the Villain's hands AQ, 6x, etc. have lost a lot of their relative hand strength by the river. He has lots of hands he could turn into a bluff.

More importantly, I think we're behind Villain's likely river bet/call range. I left off the unlikely 99/QQ/AA combos. We're behind this range: 66,QsJs,QsTs,Qs9s,Qs8s,Qs7s,Qs5s,Qs4s,Qs3s,JsTs,Js 9s,Js8s,Js7s,Js5s,Js4s,8s7s,7s5s,5s4s,5s3s,A6o,Q6o ,96o

If we think we're value-betting we need to identify lots more worse combos of hands that we expect to bet/call this river.

I can't guarantee that it's even breakeven. Does he limp call 53s in early position? Does he limp/call big pocket pairs to trap?
1/3 flop OESFD Quote
07-16-2015 , 03:59 PM
With the discussion of GTO going on, I plugged this hand into PokerSnowie. Here's the things it suggests the OP do differently next time:

He should have:
1. Open folded
2. Folded to the PFR
3. Checked the flop
4. Bet the turn
5. Not raise the river
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07-16-2015 , 04:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by au4all
With the discussion of GTO going on, I plugged this hand into PokerSnowie. Here's the things it suggests the OP do differently next time:

He should have:
1. Open folded
2. Folded to the PFR
3. Checked the flop
4. Bet the turn
5. Not raise the river
Interesting, I would have only made one of those decisions (checking the flop).

Does the application give any reasons for the decisions?

GdamnrobotsG
1/3 flop OESFD Quote
07-16-2015 , 04:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gobbledygeek
Interesting, I would have only made one of those decisions (checking the flop).

Does the application give any reasons for the decisions?

GdamnrobotsG
Just downloaded it 30 minutes ago.

it's free for 1-month test. No, no reasons, it just shows you the EV of betting/calling/folding.
1/3 flop OESFD Quote
07-16-2015 , 04:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by au4all
Just downloaded it 30 minutes ago.

it's free for 1-month test. No, no reasons, it just shows you the EV of betting/calling/folding.
Would seem pretty heavily dependent on many factors to know what the EV is of overlimping KTs after 2 limpers, no? I mean, if the table is full of wizards, probably not great; but if the table is full of postflop ******s, seems like a crime not to attempt to get into a hand with them for cheap.

GbutIknow0%aboutPokerSnowie,soIshouldn'tcommentG
1/3 flop OESFD Quote
07-16-2015 , 04:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gobbledygeek
Would seem pretty heavily dependent on many factors to know what the EV is of overlimping KTs after 2 limpers, no? I mean, if the table is full of wizards, probably not great; but if the table is full of postflop ******s, seems like a crime not to attempt to get into a hand with them for cheap.

GbutIknow0%aboutPokerSnowie,soIshouldn'tcommentG
agreed.

hard to even begin to scratch the surface of the EV without any context or relevant information.
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07-16-2015 , 05:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gobbledygeek
Would seem pretty heavily dependent on many factors to know what the EV is of overlimping KTs after 2 limpers, no? I mean, if the table is full of wizards, probably not great; but if the table is full of postflop ******s, seems like a crime not to attempt to get into a hand with them for cheap.

GbutIknow0%aboutPokerSnowie,soIshouldn'tcommentG
I don't post to change anyone's mind. I basically try to write down how I'll play a situation so when I encounter it, I'll play it "right". I feel like writing it down, helps cement the process.

I'm well-aware that virtually nobody who posts here is intending to change the way they play on any street, much less all streets, based on anything I say, or what Pokersnowie says.

In fact I'm cynical enough to believe that most people post here to hear a bunch of people say they'd play it the exact same way.

I also try think about what is standard so that when someone does something else I can categorize them at the table.

For example, I ran into a very similar situation last night, when I rivered a boat and got checked to on the river. I bet about three-quarters pot, and my Villain tank/called with the nut flush. That solidified in my mind that he was a Reg. Based on other actions he might have taken I would have given him a different mental classification.

That's why I think that knowing what's "standard" is relevant to me. Pre-flop is not the most important part of it. Getting river decisions right, when the pot is big, is usually what's most important.
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