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1/3 deep stack top top facing turn x/r 1/3 deep stack top top facing turn x/r

10-16-2016 , 04:26 AM
1/3 deep stack home game. Plays more like a 2/5.

V: Solid player overall but with some strange tendencies such as limping and always raising bottom two pair tremendously. Capable of bluffs but doesn't get out of line too often. Often calls down light. (685)

Hero: Young guy playing TAG but V probably sees hero as a LAG. Very aggressive image. (Covers)

OTTH:

UTG straddles to 6.
V limps UTG+1, MP limps, Hero raises to 30 with AsKs, folds to V who calls, MP folds.

Flop ($75): 5c6sKh
Check, hero bets 55, V calls.

Turn ($185): Qc
Check, Hero bets 100, V raises to 350 and only has 250 more behind. Hero?

The read that he always raises bottom 2 pair on flop is important here because it's cuts his value range a bit. IMO, he can have 78s, 34s, A6cc, and sets.

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1/3 deep stack top top facing turn x/r Quote
10-16-2016 , 05:01 AM
Villains raise is pretty big, could this be indicative of a huge draw trying to capitalise on FE? Villains raising range is pretty narrow in terms of value.. Vs a nit I can probably find a fold.. Vs this guy maybe not
1/3 deep stack top top facing turn x/r Quote
10-16-2016 , 05:32 AM
Is villain really limping 43s and 87s from EP? 200bb deep?


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1/3 deep stack top top facing turn x/r Quote
10-16-2016 , 05:48 AM
Insta fold. He is not x/c flop on a rainbow board then x/r turn on a with a semi-bluff anywhere near a high frequency.

There is no way you can know he raises bottom two pair 100% of the time, unless you can literally see his hole cards at every hand played. Sure, he may do it a decent % of the time but impossible 100%. Also, since the board is dry, he might slowplay it.

He has K6s/K5s/Q6s/Q5s/56o/56s/55/66/reduced KQo & KQs in his range. You need to find a tooon of bluffs & airballs (he never has these) to make stacking off here profitable. You are dead vs his value range, and his semi-bluffs (which I don't think he has a ton of) have lots of equity vs you. You are not anywhere near the top of your range here either, so no reason to call/defend. Easy GII with KK/QQ/66/55, probably tank call-off KQ.
1/3 deep stack top top facing turn x/r Quote
10-16-2016 , 06:08 AM
Yeah very good points above, beluga fold is good
1/3 deep stack top top facing turn x/r Quote
10-16-2016 , 11:33 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Minatorr
Insta fold. He is not x/c flop on a rainbow board then x/r turn on a with a semi-bluff anywhere near a high frequency.

There is no way you can know he raises bottom two pair 100% of the time, unless you can literally see his hole cards at every hand played. Sure, he may do it a decent % of the time but impossible 100%. Also, since the board is dry, he might slowplay it.

He has K6s/K5s/Q6s/Q5s/56o/56s/55/66/reduced KQo & KQs in his range. You need to find a tooon of bluffs & airballs (he never has these) to make stacking off here profitable. You are dead vs his value range, and his semi-bluffs (which I don't think he has a ton of) have lots of equity vs you. You are not anywhere near the top of your range here either, so no reason to call/defend. Easy GII with KK/QQ/66/55, probably tank call-off KQ.
I agree that usually one can't know someone raises flop with bottom 2 every time but he has done it countless times and always makes the comment "Gotta do it with bottom two, I always get sucked out on." So I'm extremely confident thats not part of his range.

The value range you assigned is far too wide. His limp range is unbalanced and contains essentially only pocket pairs, small suited As and connectors. I think the range I assigned him for value of only sets is correct, but the argument can be made that if he's going to semi-bluff he would do it on the flop as turn x/r is super strong. I can see a fold here as his semi bluffs have to be discounted heavily and can't just be thought of as 9 combos of bluffs vs 6 of value, but I don't think it's as trivial a fold as you think. If he does this with 4 bluff combos it's a profitable GII.

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1/3 deep stack top top facing turn x/r Quote
10-16-2016 , 12:05 PM
I'd fold, looks like set or top 2 to me.

I've seen this quite a bit recently: posters raising AK, hitting flop and then going for three streets of value vs reasonable players. I think it is harder than it used to be to find opponents who will meekly x/c three streets with a dominated pair on an A/K/Q high board. Mostly I only go for 3 streets vs a proper station. Otherwise I'm happy with 2 streets.

I make an exception for dry Ace high flops because I find people are still reluctant to fold Aces. Nevertheless, I'm betting quite small unless they're stations.

The Q on the turn is one of the worst cards for you. I know you say V only limps small pairs and small SC but unless you've seen him opening KQ in EP then he may also be limping it and you just haven't seen it. In my game it is a commonly held belief that AQ/KQ/AJ are no good for raises in EP. Folks limp these hands a lot.

Also, if V doesn't have any KX, what are you targeting with your flop and turn Vbets? If you're right about V limping range you have even greater reason than normal to check somewhere. I'd check flop vs this V if you're read is correct.
1/3 deep stack top top facing turn x/r Quote
10-16-2016 , 04:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragequit99
I'd fold, looks like set or top 2 to me.

I've seen this quite a bit recently: posters raising AK, hitting flop and then going for three streets of value vs reasonable players. I think it is harder than it used to be to find opponents who will meekly x/c three streets with a dominated pair on an A/K/Q high board. Mostly I only go for 3 streets vs a proper station. Otherwise I'm happy with 2 streets.

I make an exception for dry Ace high flops because I find people are still reluctant to fold Aces. Nevertheless, I'm betting quite small unless they're stations.

The Q on the turn is one of the worst cards for you. I know you say V only limps small pairs and small SC but unless you've seen him opening KQ in EP then he may also be limping it and you just haven't seen it. In my game it is a commonly held belief that AQ/KQ/AJ are no good for raises in EP. Folks limp these hands a lot.

Also, if V doesn't have any KX, what are you targeting with your flop and turn Vbets? If you're right about V limping range you have even greater reason than normal to check somewhere. I'd check flop vs this V if you're read is correct.
Going for only 2 streets makes alot of sense. I like better flop and checking back turn because I think a hand like 77 is likely to call flop and maybe hero river after a turn check.

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1/3 deep stack top top facing turn x/r Quote
10-17-2016 , 11:24 AM
Preflop for me this deep really depends on looseness of table (i.e. is a raise really going to thin the field?) and aggroness of table (i.e. good chance someone behind us raises?). The looser/aggro the table is, the more I limp to reraise to either (a) take down a bunch of dead money totally uncontested or (b) setup good SPRs for my TP type hands. In this case our preflop raise narrowed the field to HU in position, so good result.

SPRs around 9ish. I definitely don't want to stack off postflop. This guy doesn't get too out-of-line, plus calls down light, plus we have an aggro image. All told, especially with this image, I'd probably lean towards 3 small bet/folds (probably no more than 1/2 PSB otherwise we might start getting committed by the river). With a tighter image / against a bluffier opponent, I would probably check back the flop and go for two later streets. I think our flop bet is too large.

On the turn I would just continue with my bet/fold plan, and thus fold to the check/raise (noting that the most obvious hand that got there is KQ). If we're not comfortable folding to his check/raise then either (a) don't bet (and make sure we get to showdown with only one more bet and don't have to play for stacks) or (b) make sure we're comfortable playing for stacks (which we shouldn't be having gotten in just 4% of our stack preflop and our hand kinda looking exactly what it is).

GcluelessNLnoobG
1/3 deep stack top top facing turn x/r Quote
10-17-2016 , 11:41 AM
Small b/f on all streets also works for me as long as it isn't vs a bluffy V who might think to raise my small bets. Then I'd check a street.
1/3 deep stack top top facing turn x/r Quote
10-17-2016 , 12:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragequit99
Small b/f on all streets also works for me as long as it isn't vs a bluffy V who might think to raise my small bets. Then I'd check a street.
Yeah, good point re: small bets perhaps being played back at, gotta make sure that ain't the case before taking that line.

GcluelessNLnoobG
1/3 deep stack top top facing turn x/r Quote

      
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