Background
Hero - mid 20s fairly tight player. Been more passive than usual in this session. 3bet pre only twice so far in 4 hours. Stack = 500.
Villain 1 - mid 30s competent rec regular. Likes to play a few too many hands, opens frequently. Stack = 500.
Villain 2 - mid 20s tournament pro. Quite loose aggressive Stack = 2000.
Villain 3 - massive fish. Seen him in a previous session donk off 1500 when he kept buying in and loosing. Currently stuck about 500 for session already. He generally doesnt like to fold pre although he has slowed down a bit in last hour or so. Seen him cold call 4bet of 150 with AJo. Post flop plays v passively, calling down with weak hands. Stack = 200.

Pre Flop
V1 opens for 10 in UTG+1. V2 flats in MP. One other caller. V3 flats on BTN. Hero 3bets to 60 in SB with AKo. BB folds. V1 folds. V2 flats. other caller folds. V3 flats.

Flop (203)
J22hh (we don't have heart)
Checks around.

Turn
Qo
Checks around.

River
5o
Check. V2 bets 200. V3 folds. Hero?

Questions
Pre - I thought that I could take this down with a big 3bet, also wouldn't mind playing heads up vs V1, any comments?
Flop - the reason I didn't Cbet here was that V3 only had 140 behind and would call with any pair. If I did bet flop 150 or so and jam turn I think I could get V2 off anything other than a set, so maybe this makes sense?
Turn - now I have picked up gutshot should I bet?
River - big bet from V2 I think this must be a value bet as he knows that V3 would calls him v light here. Would anyone consider calling here?

this is tough i dont really see a part of his range that you can profitably call here.

OTF why are we concerned V3, being the massive fish, has a pair? He could have Jx or pocket pair, along with a ton of other garbage. After 3-betting pre oop and into a 203 dollar pot, you are committed to firing a c-bet here. If you aren't willing to fire on pretty much all flops then you should just be calling and heading to the flop. J22 (I assume rainbow) is as dry as they'll come for you.

Once you've checked the flop you may as well be on the check/fold button the rest of the way unless you spike a pair.

Pre I'm just calling. I don't see the need to play an inflated pot oop with AK. Hand is also disguised if you flop big.

If you are gonna 3bet OOP at least c-bet.

The rest I just c/f.

If you 3 bet this spot (which is great, as it really makes players play fit or fold and you are getting money in ahead of their range) you really need to cbet as it is pretty unlikely that someone is calling with a jack (even with random dude in there, making a pair is hard and you shouldn't play sacred).

I would cbet that flop which screams strength to pretty much anyone who isn't totally brain dead. As played, fold, you gave him a chance as he probably caught up.

Take AK out of ur 3b range oop if you're not cbetting flops unless you pair up. It's burning money.

++1

Look at your hand from villain perspective. You are repping a strong hand 3 betting from small blind. You either go with that story or don't 3 bet it.
You have the best flop ever to cbet. Make it like 125. You can def get small pairs which missed to fold. Etc. if you are villain directly left and you bet 125 are you calling with 55,66, 77 etc with 3 players left to act?

I don't like playing OOP in bloated pots deep with good players. So I probably just passively call preflop and quietly check/fold the flop and move on to the next hand where I'll be in position.

I'd probably also cbet the flop, but to be honest, medium high card + low pair + flush draw isn't exactly a dream board (we get looked up by medium pairs here all the time, are we willing to ship the turn if called?).

GcluelessNLnoobG

Yeah all of this...if you can't pull the trigger OTF you need to not 3ball AKo pre. Just b/f like 100-125 depending on the table.



(stole from DGI) Please visit my PGC thread and comment on any dumb hands http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/17...p-ing-1339003/

Thanks guys for your advice. In hindsight a rather easy spot to Cbet. I guess it was V3 being short that worried me. He would call with any pair (sometimes even worse!).

lol if he calls with worse than a pair then your AK high is good. Yeah he could have a pair, but he could have anything else like AQ, KQ etc. If you c-bet and he calls basically allin, you still have 20% to win if he has a small pair.

If you put the raise in pre you have to cbet this board. Always fire at paired boards.

stack sizes are real important when making your pre flop decisision.

if there is a short stacked opponent, especially if its the fishy opponent you mentioned, you have to be willing to put them all in otf if they have under a psb left. their range is much more heavily weighted towards unpaired broadways/scs ect than paired hands if they are calling with a wide range pre.

if they are calling off such a huge % of their stack with such a wide range, then it is going to be profitable for you to cbet this board in the long run, even if he is never folding a pair

as for V2, you are pretty much denying him the proper odds to set mine with your stack size, so you should take note and really consider if he is as good as you imagine. if he calls your cbet of 150 otf, i'd be wary of shoving ott unimproved unless you've seen similar actions before

I think your point about stack sizes is spot on here. In hindsight this should have been considered and this is the learning I take from this. My bet sizing was specifically high to not allow someone proper odds to set mine.

def cbet flop fold now

could just call preflop as well, but id prefer the 3bet