Passive 1/3 table

OMC is in SB
Hero on BTN
$300 eff

4 way limped pot, Hero has 66

Flop ($15): T76ss
OMC leads $20, MP old/good reg calls, Hero ?

Should I be afraid of 77/98 here and evaluate further streets or just raise/fold this to a b/3b? I'm not too comfortable even if I'm just called in these spots. In the scenario that he flopped a straight, I can always try to fill up. Is this severe MUBS? They say "never go broke in limped pots without the nuts".

Raise to $75 and consider folding if somebody shoves over top. You don't have the best possible hand but it is better to show some aggression at this point. Going into pot control at this point is MUBs, in a limped pot there are lots of spade draws, pair+straight draws and two pair hands in play also.

Not raising or being worried about set over set or a straight in this hand is a little MUBs, but against OMC I get it. I'm still raising, though: ~$75 is good. SB could easily have two pair and MP could have a ton of draws.

Proceed wth extreme caution. Depends so much on your read of OMC. Overbet looks suspicious for sure. 'normally' you wouldn't expect a big hand (set+) to lead out like this - but it's so drawy - that the 89 might be going for value when he can.

MP looks should pick up this too - expect him to have minimum a top FD.

High variance route is to raise to $100 and fold to raise or more aggr on turn if miss.
Lower variance is to call behind and use your position to re-eval. I'd personally prefer the latter.

Why are we limping a pair on the button?

Well I just called.

Turn was A and he led $20 again, MP folded, I just flatted like an idiot.

River was J and he led $50 now, obv I couldn't fold.

He shows A2

Low pair in a MW pot trying to hit a set?

I don't hate your flop flat. Once he leads turn for $20 into $75, you always have the best hand and should make a large raise (to ~$100) for value.

Raising does not diminish your chances if hitting a set

raising diminishes your implied odds

So?

I prefer actual dollars to implied odds anyway

Plus, we are 300 eff. We can raise and still be getting odds to set mine

very clever. here's bluntness for you... overlimping in this spot will be more profitable (ie, produce more actual dollars) than raising.

So we make more money when opponents put less into the pot?

Just stop, you're embarassing yourself

Call flop. You have the button, you have huge equity, and your SPR is fine for the next street. There aren't many troublesome runouts.

You won't get much action from weaker hands if you choose to raise.

^ This is horrible. Absolutely, horribly horrible.

^ Overbetting line here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fep4o5tyGNk

you make more money when YOU put less into the pot (preflop). unless you have reason to suspect tremendous fold equity preflop (which you don't), then you're setting up a situation where you will flop very poorly the vast majority of the time in a multiway pot with very little equity and poor fold equity/cbet prospects.

and im not embarrassed. and i wouldn't even be embarrassed if i misspelled words either.

Is position important in poker? Probably not if guys are playing their button by limpling pre and playing fit/fold post

The fact that you refer to it as "a pair" indicates lack of sincerity, at best. 66 plays a lot different from TT or 22.

The problem with raising is we lose the value of the hand if we get reraised from the blinds. In addition, the existing limper is likely to have a hand that plays well against our specific holding. So we would be raising purely as a bluff, turning 66 into 72.

Sklansky and Miller discuss this issue multiple times in NLHT&P. But I suppose a natural talent such as yourself doesn't read outdated, pedantic drivel.

Your basic and profound flaw is that you believe the object of NLHE is to win the pot. It isn't. It was scientifically proven DECADES ago that the players who win the most pots lose the most money.

I've found that this bet is often either:

A) A hand strong enough for a OMC to be willing to play for stacks, where he wants to get money into the pot and price out draws
B) A strong draw, where he would be happy to take it down on the flop

His turn bet-sizing often gives away which one.

It wouldn't be unusual to see a player like this have a range of 98/TT/77/nut flush draw/combo draws/maybe two pair.

there are circumstances when limping and playing fit/fold is the best option. there are circumstances when raising limpers is the best option. position is an important factor in both. learn to recognize which is which. "frequent strength" of the hand you choose is one important factor that you aren't considering, else not understanding.

but... your condescending, know-it-all attitude has won me over. you are right. i am wrong. well done.

i read in another thread that you've been put on "ignore" status by a respected poster. its not hard to see why. not sure what your purpose of posting here is, but humbling trying to get better and learn from those who are more advanced in their understanding than you, doesn't seem to be part of your reasons. for your benefit: you don't have a very solid grasp of the fundamentals of the game. you think you do. or at least you pretend you do. but your thought process is not solid (in multiple threads ive read).. that, in itself, isn't a problem.. but combined with an unwillingness to learn, it becomes not only debilitating for your development and for those whom you might sway.. but also a waste of time for serious posters. ill give you one more chance before i "ignore". best of luck

I'd like to ask about this in particular, because I feel like I've been seeing advice to to do exactly this (raise/fold on flop) a LOT around here recently. You don't think you'd be called by worse, like overpairs, flush draws, pairs+draws? Surely you would raise turn, right?

I absolutely raise the flop here. Two pair and big flush draws will often come along and might re-raise. Never folding, of course. This board is so draw-heavy I hate to give a "free" card.

If they fold weak or drawing hands, I'm fine with that.

Once we flat flop, we have to raise the turn.

Been gone all weekend, gotta catch up on my red font....

Raise pre-flop. Anything else is scared money.

Raise PF. If you are correctly widening your PF button play, this seems like a good spot to put in a sweetener. I would have liked info on the 4th player...but still a raise for me most of the time.

Raise the flop as played..and don't be cheap. This board hit our villain's ranges (3 limpers) pretty hard.


(post-grunch)
Raise OMC turn as played. This seems so automatic to me that I can't understand the thinking behind a call. His bet sizing is either the nuts or a draw. Ranging.... probably puts this as a draw. (I'm not doing the stoving)

Are we calling if OMC 3bets a flop raise?

As long as I raise "enough" to make his OMC reraise legit, I can release.