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1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot 1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot

02-13-2014 , 03:49 PM
New to the table about 10 hands in, 9-handed. Very loose-passive/limpy game from what I have seen. Have seen AQo gii pf vs AKo, not much other action.

Villain UTG+2 is OMC. Short stack BTN (~£40) is young, he just came back to table after break so no reads.

I have ~£130 behind, Villain UTG+2 covers

I pick up QQ UTG+1

I raise to £10 pf, Villain 3bets to £30 quite quickly. Folds around to short stack who just calls with about £10 behind. Folds to me and I call.

Pot £93

Flop: 552

I check, Villain UTG+2 bets £35, SS BTN calls all-in for £10.

What is everyone's action here? I think I should've bet flop... Pretty annoyed with how I played this hand.
1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot Quote
02-13-2014 , 04:07 PM
Would OMC 3-bet pre with AK? His flop bet is really light considering the board. I think I'm AI after starting the hand w/65 bbs.

I'd top-off to 100 bbs.
1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot Quote
02-13-2014 , 04:14 PM
If you're calling pre then you should be stacking off here.
1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot Quote
02-13-2014 , 04:15 PM
I'd fold pre. Omc doesn't really 3 bet AK so this is JJ+
1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot Quote
02-13-2014 , 04:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by samo
Would OMC 3-bet pre with AK? His flop bet is really light considering the board. I think I'm AI after starting the hand w/65 bbs.

I'd top-off to 100 bbs.
Doubt it, he is relatively unknown but in this game I have mostly seen flatting w AKo/AKs. I was immediately cautious when he 3bet.

Thought if I don't flop a set I'm done with this hand but then flop changed my mind!

I think I was fine with stacking off on this flop but I definitely played it wrong.

I checked (hoping to keep his AK bluffs in) and then just called (???) Rather than shoved). Then shoved turn (8)

He called, river J

He had KK (no diamond)



What are people's thoughts on bet/folding the flop? With hindsight, not being results orientated, I think this is the correct play
1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot Quote
02-13-2014 , 04:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by slimshady1999
I'd fold pre. Omc doesn't really 3 bet AK so this is JJ+
This was my first thought pre-flop but I wouldn't be able to sleep after being that nitty.
1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot Quote
02-13-2014 , 05:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by t0pb1ll1n
Doubt it, he is relatively unknown but in this game I have mostly seen flatting w AKo/AKs. I was immediately cautious when he 3bet.

Thought if I don't flop a set I'm done with this hand but then flop changed my mind!

I think I was fine with stacking off on this flop but I definitely played it wrong.

I checked (hoping to keep his AK bluffs in) and then just called (???) Rather than shoved). Then shoved turn (8)

He called, river J

He had KK (no diamond)





What are people's thoughts on bet/folding the flop? With hindsight, not being results orientated, I think this is the correct play
If you can't realistically include AK in his PF 3-bet range, you should fold pre. You are ahead of JJ, chopping QQ but behind AA/KK. There are more combos ahead of you.

With 130 as the eff stack, calling 20 doesn't price you in to set-mine.
1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot Quote
02-13-2014 , 05:56 PM
where did you play this op? fox or vic? i see you're in london :-)

if you know the guy is super tight then he shows up with the sort of hand he had quite often, as standard with your stack size though the chips should be going in on this runout. why did you check flop btw? if i check in this spot it's to induce a bet so i can shove over the top and have some extra value in the pot, i take it you didn't check to fold?
1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot Quote
02-13-2014 , 06:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by samo
If you can't realistically include AK in his PF 3-bet range, you should fold pre. You are ahead of JJ, chopping QQ but behind AA/KK. There are more combos ahead of you.

With 130 as the eff stack, calling 20 doesn't price you in to set-mine.
This.
1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot Quote
02-14-2014 , 12:28 AM
Fold Pre, don't call 3bets OOP

Especially when your ep open gets 3bet by OMC also from ep

Sent from my SCH-I545 using 2+2 Forums
1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot Quote
02-14-2014 , 01:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by t0pb1ll1n
This was my first thought pre-flop but I wouldn't be able to sleep after being that nitty.
Then get over it. This hand is an excellent reminder of knowing relative strength. Yes you have the third nuts pre, but if you think he can't have AK, then you are crushed against his range. You got attached to your hand and couldn't see beyond the fact that your hand while strong is no good against his range
1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot Quote
02-14-2014 , 02:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by t0pb1ll1n
Doubt it, he is relatively unknown but in this game I have mostly seen flatting w AKo/AKs. I was immediately cautious when he 3bet.

Thought if I don't flop a set I'm done with this hand but then flop changed my mind!

I think I was fine with stacking off on this flop but I definitely played it wrong.

I checked (hoping to keep his AK bluffs in) and then just called (???) Rather than shoved). Then shoved turn (8)

He called, river J

He had KK (no diamond)



What are people's thoughts on bet/folding the flop? With hindsight, not being results orientated, I think this is the correct play
Bet folding is bad here as he could have JJ and ship on you. I won't run the man but you need 2:1 to call a shove against all JJ+. Flop is a check fold. You made the mistake of calling pre, don't compound on it.
1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot Quote
02-14-2014 , 04:35 AM
A good sign that maybe we should've folded preflop is when we get the best board possible for our hand other than hitting a set and we still don't feel comfortable facing a pretty standard c-bet.
1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot Quote
02-14-2014 , 07:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by samo
If you can't realistically include AK in his PF 3-bet range, you should fold pre. You are ahead of JJ, chopping QQ but behind AA/KK. There are more combos ahead of you.

With 130 as the eff stack, calling 20 doesn't price you in to set-mine.
Agreed, knew I didn't have io or direct odds to set mine. Bad call pre. It's spots like this where folding QQ pre (although I'm very sure I'm beat) just seems wrong. Its not a 4bet, he hasn't been proven to be the nittiest of nits , but 3bets in EP from ppl like him (older than 50) are either KK or AA and sometimes but not as often QQ. So I knew I should fold but the donk in me said omg can't fold qq pre vs 1 bet.

And then the donk in me said 552 okay I'm stacking off. U have KK yeah?
1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot Quote
02-14-2014 , 07:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hainesy_2KT
where did you play this op? fox or vic? i see you're in london :-)

if you know the guy is super tight then he shows up with the sort of hand he had quite often, as standard with your stack size though the chips should be going in on this runout. why did you check flop btw? if i check in this spot it's to induce a bet so i can shove over the top and have some extra value in the pot, i take it you didn't check to fold?
Blatant bumhunting is just rude.

Just kidding, this hand was at empire but I've played at Hippo, Vic n aspers too. And Fox before it closed (it's reopened now as a casino I believe).

I checked cos I thought KK/AA is calling but AK isn't whereas AK will probably fire a cbet so value from hands I'm ahead of. Was gonna shove but hesitated, got it in on turn. Badly played bla bla bla
1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot Quote
02-14-2014 , 07:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by slimshady1999
Then get over it. This hand is an excellent reminder of knowing relative strength. Yes you have the third nuts pre, but if you think he can't have AK, then you are crushed against his range. You got attached to your hand and couldn't see beyond the fact that your hand while strong is no good against his range
Thank you, well put. Think deep down I knew that as I felt sick throughout the hand, basically just knew I was behind, but couldn't find the fold button
1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot Quote
02-14-2014 , 07:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by daniel9861
A good sign that maybe we should've folded preflop is when we get the best board possible for our hand other than hitting a set and we still don't feel comfortable facing a pretty standard c-bet.
Well said, thanks


Learnt a lot from this discussion
1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot Quote
02-14-2014 , 07:58 AM
How are you sure V is an OMC after playing 10 hands?
1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot Quote
02-14-2014 , 09:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambre
How are you sure V is an OMC after playing 10 hands?
Tbh not sure, but he was >50 and had only played one hand, limp called and then folded to cbet on the flop.
1-2NL QQ in 3bet pot Quote

      
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