V ($400) is a young, middle eastern guy and not a regular at the casino. He has been raising $8-12 every other hand and seems like a good player.

Hero ($500) hasn’t been out of line in the half an hour he’s been at the table. Just playing TAG.


V opens 12 in CO,
BTN (150) calls,
Hero raises to 55 in SB with AA,
V calls,
BTN calls.

Flop (165): 422r
Hero cbets 50, V calls, BTN folds

Turn (265): 2x
Hero bets 110, V tanks and folds

Did I play this wrong? Does my double barrel look super strong? I don’t see any other way to get stacks in.

I figured he had a lower PP and I could check turn to look like AK or something and encourage V to think his 99 or something is good, but I am never getting his stack that way. If he checks behind turn, I might get another $100 OTR. If he bets turn, he’s shutting down if I continue by calling or x/raising so same result. I was just hoping he has QQ or something and can’t lay it down.

Should I just cbet big/unbalanced on such a bone-dry flop because pairs won’t fold to one bet and Ahi might fold to any bet, so even if turn goes check/check, I can shove river?

You played the hand well and this guy has to be a super good player at a 1/2 game to let go of any PP on that board. My guess is the V here probably has a range of a lot of suited connectors, suited broadway cards, and Kx,Ax,Qx suited holdings if he's raising as much as you say. So yeah he's peeling on the flop and pretty much folding all turn bets if he doesnt connect. The thing wih your bet on the turn is you're pretty capped at that point saying you've got a high pocket pair or AKs. IMO i would play it this way almost all the time while mixing in a check on the turn every so often with my strong holdings to try and stay balanced.

I guess he folded AK or like pocket 7's at the very best. Zeebo's Theorem.

Imo you should check the flop three way, especially with BTN on 60% pot behind. He might just rip in atc when checked to. Also, the preflop opener will usually put BTN in if he has a pair and you check the flop to him. Even if it checks around, it's not hard to get stacks in by the river.

Depending on the player under betting the flop may have been a mistake. You bet the flop very small and then continued small on the turn. It looks a lot like you are picking sizes to setup a river shove rather then apply any pressure. Betting flop bigger, checking turn and then betting river could be a better line but likely doesn't stack villain.

Part of it is just that you can't expect to stack villain with one pair for 200BB. Technically you have two pair post flop but practically it's the same. To get that much in the pot you either have to take a super aggressive line or you need villain to raise at some point, either way if stacks go in one pair probably isn't best. Once you get that kind of deep you should be trying to make your one pair hands consistently profitable rather then aiming for stacks.

Best advice that seems to get overlooked or dismissed in a lot of threads with big pocket pairs. I don't know exactly where the number of bigs is, but 200+ is definitely past that line.

This isnt 2004. You dont stack people for 200BBs with one pair. Unless the guy is drunk or a complete idiot.

I like a bigger bet on the flop honestly, possibly checking the turn.

I think you've identified the problem, it's just you need to focus on the other guy's perspective.

You're betting in such a way that you're threatening the Villain's entire stack. If you want your bet to get called do something other than clearly indicate you're planning on shoving the river.

The Villain is thinking why call the turn unless I want to play for stacks --- might was well fold now.

Yes a 3! out of the SB and a double barrel looks strong. It's suppose to look strong.

That turn is probably a perfect card to check though. An over pair is only drawing to two outs and it keeps his floats in.

Villain may think you have AK and attack the pot.

This seems like a very silly spot to waste time thinking about.

We want to play these spots in a manner that ensure we get max value against a hand like TT or JJ.

Are you taking this line with any bluffs (I hope so)


Seems ridiculously results oriented to take this line, have villain fold turn, and then start questioning your play just b/c you have AA and didn't stack the other guy.

Here's your answer right here.

And for those who say you can't stack someone for 200 bigs with just one pair, you really mean you cannot do it by playing abc poker.

You probably got more value on the flop then you probably deserved. Wouldn't be surprised if this V called the flop with K high. You just ran into the bottom of this guys range. Not barreling off in this spot is criminal.

This is 1/2. No need for fancy play.

I like this line here as well for stacking V. You V to bluff catch / Hero call so you need to rep a bluff. Bet $105 on flop. Check turn and fire away huge on river.

Though I think this isn’t the max EV line. Bet flop larger with 100% of range. Size flat or down even on turn. Bet about the same on river.

[PHP][/PHP] If I would have read this first in wouldn't Have posted. Just exactly what this guys says.

How are you possibly getting another $300 in if you check the turn though??

Sure.

But you are not stacking your opponent for 200 bigs with TP.

We don't know that. Our opponent never would have folded JJ+ on that board so we should get value while we can on the turn. The only reason V folded is because he was holding big Broadway cards with one card to go.

I like a small cbet on this texture, but 50 might be too small, after all it is a 3bet pot, and we are out of position. Furthermore, if v has an overpair we can almost certainly get a call right now.

With 165 out there, and 345 behind, we can bet

70, and if called it will create a pot of 305, with 275 behind. Now we can check the turn to induce a bet from a pair protecting from AK, and if it checks thru we can still jam the river for less than pot.


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Hero's line is fine and should be taking it with broadway hands that block big pairs as well. Checking flop or turn in a 3b pot with this stack depth is just bad.


We should be betting our entire range small OTF (like you did)

Turn size is fine being 400 eff, checking here is bad when we turn one of the best cards in the deck for our range and keeps us from getting max value when villain actually has a hand.

Line looks good. I ask the same thing about flop sizing myself and I’m still torn on it. I think overall I like the smaller sizing since it leads to unpaired hands floating but I see the merit in being unbalanced with value here against people we won’t play with again.

Given that we are OOP, I also don’t mind a check with aces since their overpairs are extremely likely to bet for us. They also often use some huge sizing anyway to protect against AK. Depends on the villain type. The main problem with checking is it’s going to be hard to get 3 streets since they will often check back river. We need the check to be inducing some bluffs.

Don’t model your game after one bad experience. I 4 bet aces a few weeks ago HJ v CO or CO v Button and someone new to the table folded QQ face up. He was another winning player and he knows how nutted the population’s 4 bet range is. That doesn’t mean 4 betting aces was bad, just bad against that villain.

Stop being so results-oriented all the time (this is wishful thinking, you're most likely never gonna stop doing that). You are not entitled to anyone's stack just because you happen to have a good hand. Maybe he's not an idiot and you're a nit, or maybe he just had Ace high or whatever. Either way, it's waste of your time worrying about this.

Also, going for max value is not necessarily the same thing as trying to get stacks in. I'm not saying that is the case with this hand, but as a general rule it's still something you might want to keep in mind.

My win rate over the last 1100 hours of 2/5 is $52/hr.....and Ive won 200BBs exactly once in that time frame. Like Homey said, forget about getting stacks in and concentrate on getting max value in every hand. You dont need to win massive pots to be successful. Max value can vary widely from hand to hand and its very player dependent. If people bluff a lot more than they call big bets, then check to them and let them bluff. If people call huge bets but check back and are afraid to bet themselves, then fire big bets at them.

Some truthbombs from Homey and Mike in this thread. Well said guys.

3-bet sizing was good. c-bet was too small , i'd say bet at least half pot, turn is a great card to check because you don't need to protect your hand against any draws and you could open the door for him to bluff or for you to get value on the river.