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1/2 NL: AKo, TPTK easy fold? 1/2 NL: AKo, TPTK easy fold?

03-10-2015 , 05:20 PM
Hi there. Long time reader of the forum, never posted a reply or a hand. So
This is my first foray. Sorry if the formatting is bad I'm posting from the phone,
One day after the hand so some details are sketchy.

7 handed at Local card room.
Hero ($375ish):early 30s white/hipster looking guy. I look quite a bit younger. Playing Some what weak passive, some limping and hoping to play hands against one V that is manically spewing chips. Table has seen me get it all in preflop for about $100 twice once with 99 and another with KJs against maniac. not sure if that effects hand. Maniac is not a significant V in this hand.

V1 CO: ($275): Mid 30s guy. Playing snug, folding preflop a lot. Haven't seen him get involved in any notable hands.
V2 BTN($90): older middle eastern guy. Everyone knows him in poker room. Open raises semi-light with position, c-bets and gives up on turn, calls down wih TP and draws. Typical loose 1/2 player.

The hand:
2 limps to me, I have AhKx. I raise to $13. Probably too small as table is calling wide. Average preflop raise is $12-$15? I make a joke that I'm going to stack off with this hand. That was dumb but I've been drinking a bit and often overdue it with table talk.
V1: calls
V2: calls.
Blinds and limpers call.

7 handed ($91. No rake in this room)
Flop: Kx10h5h
Checks to me I bet $75. V1 snap shoves AI $260. V2 calls for less ($75) and is AI.
Folds back to me.

Thoughts on flop bet-size and flop situation. Will post results in 2 days.
Thanks. Couldn't get the suit icons to work.
1/2 NL: AKo, TPTK easy fold? Quote
03-10-2015 , 05:35 PM
yea, I'm folding. V1 sounds like he's playing close to the vest.
1/2 NL: AKo, TPTK easy fold? Quote
03-10-2015 , 05:43 PM
Snap fold. Having the ace of hearts takes away a bunch of draws.
1/2 NL: AKo, TPTK easy fold? Quote
03-10-2015 , 05:48 PM
I'm calling here, and my instinct is that it's not very close. You're calling $185 to win $500, and there are a lot of draws in V1's range and garbage in V2's range.
1/2 NL: AKo, TPTK easy fold? Quote
03-10-2015 , 06:01 PM
I didn't think about the pot odds...need to be good 37% of the time. Maybe it is a call then. I wouldn't think V1 is on QJ, but I could see KhQh,KhJh sometimes. Somehow they always manage to show me 55,TT,KT though...
1/2 NL: AKo, TPTK easy fold? Quote
03-10-2015 , 06:50 PM
This is such a gross spot because of how bloated the pot became preflop with 7 players calling a raise.

It is a really draw heavy board, but the villain you described probably doesn't shove here light or with just a draw in a 7 way pot.

I feel like this is a call, but I don't have any good logic or math to back it up. There is just so much dead money in the pot, and you have a some backdoor straight and flush draws to the nuts as well. If you think it is possible V1 could shove here with KQ or KJ, it makes calling a lot easier.

It is worth considering that V1 is even less likely to have a draw here with V2 calling. V2 is very likely to have a flush draw or QJ in this spot I think.

I'll be interested to see what some other more experienced players here think.

Last edited by Mr.Malice; 03-10-2015 at 07:16 PM.
1/2 NL: AKo, TPTK easy fold? Quote
03-10-2015 , 06:57 PM
I'm leaning towards a fold. We seem to be flipping or crushed. We're way ahead quite seldom.
1/2 NL: AKo, TPTK easy fold? Quote
03-10-2015 , 07:01 PM
What hands could V1 be shoving with?

AK, KT, TT, 55, QhJh, KhQh, KhJh, ???? If it is just these hands, is calling profitable given the size of the pot? What if we add KQo and KJo to his range?

Last edited by Mr.Malice; 03-10-2015 at 07:11 PM.
1/2 NL: AKo, TPTK easy fold? Quote
03-10-2015 , 07:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShermanTank
I didn't think about the pot odds...need to be good 37% of the time. Maybe it is a call then. I wouldn't think V1 is on QJ, but I could see KhQh,KhJh sometimes. Somehow they always manage to show me 55,TT,KT though...
nice math
1/2 NL: AKo, TPTK easy fold? Quote
03-10-2015 , 07:27 PM
Thanks for all the responses! Although I didn't know the player well my gut feeling was that he wasn't on a draw. If he was it might be QhJH. KhJh made some sense. Also thought he could have AK, I see bad players flat AK in position all the time. The math kinda looked like a call, but I honestly didn't think I was ahead 37% against this guy. Hate to draw to back door flush/straight. Will post results whenever people are interested.
1/2 NL: AKo, TPTK easy fold? Quote
03-10-2015 , 07:31 PM
Results please
1/2 NL: AKo, TPTK easy fold? Quote
03-10-2015 , 07:33 PM
I believe his shoving range is AK, the sets (he doesn't have KK), QhJh, and probably KhQh, KhJh. I actually think he folds K10 pre, he wasn't getting massive pot odds since he was the first to call my raise. I think we take all the "garbage" hands out of his range. He's probably flatting with Kx. I was positive I was ahead of V2 but that doesn't really matter right?
1/2 NL: AKo, TPTK easy fold? Quote
03-10-2015 , 08:01 PM
Results?
1/2 NL: AKo, TPTK easy fold? Quote
03-10-2015 , 08:44 PM
I tanked. V2 calls clock after a whole and says "you know you're gonna give him the chips" or something to that effect. Implying I will stack of to V1. I fold. V1 has tens for mid set, V2 had Kh6h (or Kh and some heart below a ten, don't remember exactly). The set holds up and I muck face down. Some people at the table comment that I made a good fold with Aces.
1/2 NL: AKo, TPTK easy fold? Quote
03-10-2015 , 09:12 PM
I'm late to the thread so I saw results but before I scrolled that far my thoughts were:

Since v is tight And we block the NFD And if your op is correct v called with out the LOL pot odds (ie he was an early caller not closing the action) his calling range should be skewed toward stronger calling hands and pairs.
1/2 NL: AKo, TPTK easy fold? Quote
03-11-2015 , 01:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sauhund
nice math
Sorry. Not good at that. What did I miss isn't it 185/500?
1/2 NL: AKo, TPTK easy fold? Quote

      
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