just to make sure that everyone knows what kind of whale i mean

whale sits down with his friend and they both buy in for ~$1000,there was already a little bit of crazy action with him,then after around 30mins this hand happens




around 2hours later,whale made a lot of crazy plays (including some big bluffs),seems like he just want to play a tone of big pots and splash around,already down around $2000,i unfortunately had to play really tight because he and his friend had position on me and were making constantly ridiculous big raises/3bets,so in his eyes i'm probably one of the biggest nits at the table


tight player in early position limps,1 fish after him limp behind,i isoraise btn with KK to $30,whale in BB coldcall,tight player 3bets to $150 i call,whale call

I have around $1800 stack at that moment,both players are covering me

Flop (~$460)

7QJ

whale leads $80,tight player thinks a little bit then call,i call too

Turn (~$700)

5

whale say's "KK,AA" to me+ tight player,and simultaneously bets $210,tight player folds instantly,i laugh about his comment and call relatively fast

River (~$1100)

9

whale thinks for first time in the hand a little bit then checks..

Still ~$1300 left

was not really sure what to do here,as you can see from the first hand he is a special kind of player,but now 2hours later he probably see's me as the ubernit which could influence his callingrange..

so what to do? just shove slightly over potsize and hope that i beat more than 50% of his callingrange?

make a small valuebet from ~$300? and then call if he shove or fold?

or just be happy about a showdown in a ~550bb pot with just a one pair hand and check behind?

raise the flop

Bet something like $300 and call a shove.

There is a guy like this that frequents the home game I play in. He NEVER would check this river beating you. Guys like this get off on beating AA and KK, if he had those beat he's shoving.

These guys make the game high variance, but I am pretty sure you are good here 60%+

Here is an example from Monday with my maniac. He also had position on me.

$500 effective.

Hero co villain btn straddles to $10 (1/2/10)

One limper to me I see TT and make it $40, villain and limper call.

Flop $123 - QQ4r
X, hero bets $40, call, fold

Turn $203 - 7r
Hero checks, villain shoves $420ish, hero snap calls and hears "good call"

I fade his 1 over card and scoop.

He also shoves a Q here and I know this, but he is shoving probably 80%+ of his range when I lead flop small and check turn.

OMG, raise the flop. As played, raise the turn.

As played, I just check behind. He's a certain type of player, but it doesn't seem as if he's stupid. He puts you on AA/KK, do you really think he's calling or shoving with worse? Does he actually think you'd fold AA/KK at this point? I highly doubt it.

I am NEVER raising flop here. River I am betting $200.

Elaborate why u never raise plz

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Why just flat the 3b preflop?

I wondered about flatting pre-flop, too, but I can get behind that a little more. I definitely don't want to lose the whale. Maybe this would have been a good spot to click it back. However, the tight player 3betting Hero is a little scary. Would suck if he 5bet -- not much he could/should have but AA in that case (or the other KK).

It's $80 into $460 and we need to get ~$1,600 in by the river. Plus, board is very drawy.

River seems like a super standard checkback.

i flat the 3bet pre because i don't want to 4bet/fold KK pre,i have absolutly no intention to go broke pre with KK against a tight player for 900bb and of course i want to play with the whale instead of isolating the tight player,thought that's kind of obv..

would like to see some arguments for/against raise flop,spr is not the problem we can easily get it in until river without raising or overbetting if that's our goal..

and if you think raise flop is not good in this situation how about raising turn?

also how about betting smaller than $300 on the river maybe just throw in 1 or 2 $100 chips?

overall would like to see some arguments for or against some action instead of just the simple action.

Yea i like something very small like 100-200 and call a shove

I think it is played fine and I’d check behind. You can’t get too crazy pre or on flop because good player can easily have AA

played a little bit around with cardrunnersev,under the assumption that tight player will raise at least with 40% frequency his sets vs whale donkbet instead of slowplaying them on drawy 3way flop and will always fold his one pair hands against a raise from me (which he should and i'm pretty sure he would do) best play is probably to raise/fold ~$500 flop vs utg and get it in against whale on flop or most turns

was overwhelmed from potsize+ deepstacks and played like chicken

still not a big fan of raise turn,and would prefer to bet $100 or $200 as played on river instead of checking behind which i did


whale had Jx4 btw (which was despite his playstyle still a big surprise for me),so even my flop line was a misplay against his range it was probably max + ev against his hand


edit:

thanks for all the input