Table: Juicy table. Lost of PFR with a steady mix of FOS and decent hands. Lots of aggression, few truly nutted hands. My kinda table, had I not been card dead for the first 3 hours and broken my normal rule of not talking too much. Mostly movie and tv stuff, some strategy with the guy next to me (major nono I know). Bet sizing at the table is mostly Level 0-1, i.e. Ohhh he there's a bet - how big is the bet. No real sizing based on players and pot size.

V1: Guy next to me. Unfortunately I had talked strategy earlier in the session with him. Early 40s, aggro, stacked with AK vs AJ reloaded for 200 max and ran up to around 600 at the time of this hand.

Hero: Young, hoodie and headphone type. Had been a rock for 3 hours stealing here and there but I don't think table really noticed because of how much I was talking, but currently on the edge of starting a heater, table knows this. Stack around 165, maybe a little less.

Hand:
V makes it 12 from UTG, 2 calls to Hero in the BB
Hero looks down at 88, calls looking to setmine

Flop (48) : 6J8 hh
Hero donks 20 because I'm 90% sure I'll get raised by someone looking me up
V thinks, raises to 54
Folds to hero
Hero goes AI for ~130 more

Now this was my dilemma. V is a thinking player (we both know eachother are solid players due to talking strat and other topics earlier). I have seen him semibluff OESD, nut flush draws, and a mix of other hands when he has a read that you're FOS.

PF I ranged him 22-TT, AJs+, a mix of ATC like Jxs looking to steal but will play aggressively with a great draw. After his raise I'm thinking 22-TT, AJs, and j6 or j8, but any hand also having a flush draw.

I don't want a turn or river without GII as I'm unlikely to improve. And if I call, I'm left with less than a 1/2PSB. So I shove OTF for a roughly PSB.

Thoughts?

Given table dynamics and reads, I think your general line here is fine. That said, however, if you're going to donk thinking that V will raise, I might make the donk bet a little higher ($30-35) so that it makes your shove over his raise not quite so high.

Seems well played to me.

Pretty absurd assumption.

Your question should be if leading for less than half pot on this flop texture is good.

The shove as played is automatic.

this is all stack size issues.

im fine with preflop.

you have a pretty great stack for CRAI on flop...that said I kind of like a lead but disagree with sizing. 30-35 looks like the right number. If he raises he commits himself and if he calls you are left with a pot sized shove on turn.

Never flatting flop after raise, ever.

Your line is fine.

just like the other thread today but in reverse - we shove this hand because we also want to shove AXhh, 9Thh, and such.

Why u playing short stacked? As played it's fine although I'd bet bigger on flop. Can't rely on ppl raising all the time

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I'm not a shortstacker. Max buy-in is $200, after 3 hours of nothing I was doing pretty well to be at where I was at.

heh.




Well played though. Looks pretty standard.

I don't always rely on others. But after 3 hours of nothing but studying the table, 90% raises to flop donks is on the low end, no joke.

I wouldn't say this is normal per se, but at this table it was.

he might be saying you should top up to $200 once you drop down as low as you did.

some players keep a stack of reds in their pockets and chip up every time they drop down below the max buyin.

Ah. Fair point.

I've never been one to chip up, I prefer adjusting to table and conditions.

Hand looks fine, although I agree with others to donk bigger OTF.

Not sure I understand why you think you will get raised when you donk but if so need to bet more to marry villain to the pot. I think 35-40 should do that. As played shoving is standard. His flop raise sizing is a bit odd though.

3 hours of doing nothing but spectating, nearly any donk bet < 30 is getting raised.

But yeah I probably could have donked bigger.

wp

I guess I take a different line based on stack sizes and the hand. In this spot I am wanting to double up, not just win 60 bucks.

His flop raise looks to me more like a AJ or Jx combos with a very low likelihood of 2 pairs and FDs (I think FDs call behind or raise larger and 2 pair raises much larger to push out draws).

If I shove flop I think villain folds virtually all hands, so it is the conservative safe play.

Instead I flat the turn raise to make it look like I have Jx and then check almost all turns except a 3rd heart (which I shove so he doesn't catch a cheap 4 card flush).

I think checking the turn gets him to bet overpairs, large J's, 2 pairs, or bluff etc thinking you have a flush or straight draw or naked J. Then you shove and he probably calls with any decent hands (worse than your set) or folds if bluffing.

Again, the way you played is fine and a solid and conservative approach, but I don't think necessarily maximized the strength of our hand against his range.

played fine op, don't be results oriented.

I do not understand this logic.

In this spot the flop 3 bet shove screams to me "I am really strong and want to get my money in on this scary board"... if I were villain I would think it is at least 2 pair with the very occasional FD. As such I think villain folds a ton of decent hands that we could get lots of turn/river value from on the majority of turn cards.

The shove is standard, I just don't necessarily think in this specific spot it maximizes value, as opponent flop raise makes it look more like a strong 1 pair type of hands which we crush, vs. a draw which we fear.

Well there are so many action killers for your hand on turn, that I believe you lose value by not shoving. Plus most people are taking the identical line with their combo draws. Villian raised to 54$, it will be 76$ more for him to call.

He has committed to the hand - then again I guess he could fold? Leaving him to be the target at the table for the rest of the night.

Interesting alternative.

Duly noted.

That's where I differ from you in this specific hand. I think the size of his flop raise means there are a ton less action killers for our hand on the turn because I don't think villian draws play it that way nearly as often as strong 1/2 pair type hands.

why he be folding strong made hands on such draw heavy board? Action killer would mean a heart comes on turn and he wince folds the big one and two pairs which he would never fold on flop.

Think you played it just fine.

I like leading out. You get tons of value from draws, and yes there's a chance someone will raise, but that's not why you should lead. So I don't like your rationale.

You lead this flop because you're on a 4-way super wet connected flop, and there's an excellent chance that villain will not c-bet unless he really does have something (in which case he won't fold to your lead, anyway), and others would be able to check to take a free card in draw-city, and you will miss out on major value in the hand.

So yes, leading the flop is good. Check/raising is an alternative, too, but I just prefer to get chips in the pot, and there are a ton of hands that will play poker with you.

I don't like your bet sizing though. Go $35. I think you bet small because you had that idea in your head that you were going to lead out small to somehow induce a lighter raise, but that's really a good plan here. People are going to play pretty straight forward in this hand (drawy, connected, 4-way), and they're not going to raise you light with air. So go ahead and bet larger for value.

Once he raises, 3-betting all-in is totally standard. Villain is getting 2:1, so if he's really raise/folding that just seems pretty bad. In fact, it's very possible that he's making a mistake by raise/folding if he has a draw with decent equity after he puts in 40% of effective stacks.

Damnit after all that, I totally misread the board, thought it was 678hh. Your actual flop isn't as wet a flop as I thought. I think it's close, but I might be a little more inclined to check here a lot and put the action to the pre-flop raiser, probably putting in a c/r and not folding. The flop is wet, and there's some connection, but you just end up getting a lot of folds from hands that you don't really want to fold.