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Old 04-13-2014, 02:25 AM   #1
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1/2 Disaster

Hey guys,

Table is full of loose passives willing to call 10x pre with garbage.

Hero/BB(400) Young 20s whitey probably viewed as LAG, have been getting a decent card rush a raising it up alot pre.

V1/HJ(800) older 50s guy who is somewhat stationy, loose passive pre but aggressive post flop.

V2/EP(400) old tight passive grandma, mostly irrelevant.

The world limps

Hero makes it 20 with AQ

UTG moves all in for 23.
Gram calls
V1 calls.
Hero lol calls

Flop(100) 335

Hero leads out 55
Gram tank calls
V1 tank calls

Turn(265) A

Hero leads 125
Gram folds
V1 moves in.
Hero dies a little inside.

Please chastise me.
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Old 04-13-2014, 02:39 AM   #2
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Re: 1/2 Disaster

I think i'd check the turn card, or delay c-bet (And maybe raise more pre, on this table). I am guessing you are in the blinds?
AP: fold.
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Old 04-13-2014, 07:08 AM   #3
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Re: 1/2 Disaster

bump for punishment
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Old 04-13-2014, 07:46 AM   #4
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Re: 1/2 Disaster

Hey again deadfish

Honestly I would delay cbet as well. This is definitely a flop you want to bet with fewer people in the hand, but with 2 behind you and 1 all in there really isn't much incentive to bet.

Neither of these players are going to fold a PP here on the flop, plus one guy is all in so there's less of a reason to try and get folds since you still have to win vs him at showdown.
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Old 04-13-2014, 08:08 AM   #5
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Re: 1/2 Disaster

Be aware of sstack sizes at the table. If you want to avoid bloated mw pots, either overlimp or raise to half the sstack ES so you can iso the dead $$$ when everyone flats (I esp like this if a sstack limps in early pos, or is in the blinds).

AP, you might have gotten folds from dominated FDs which *is a disaster.

On the flop, the board texture isn't exactly A+ but it's wet enough to check through. All middle pp will c/c your cbet. Take the free turn and evaluate, but we can likely bet and take it down (delayed cbet) if checked through, or, simply fold if a player suddenly bets anything larger than 1/2 pot.

AP, V1 overcall is weighted toward Ax diamond draws and 66-JJ, as well as one 33, three 55, and 2d4d. OTT, V1 basically never turns the mid pp's into a bluff, so semi-bluffs with the pair+SFD seem most likely. Crunch the above range and evaluate your equity, check the pot odds...decision made.

This is highly dependent upon your view of V as aggro. Against any standard LLSNL V, this is a b/f or, 200bb deep OOP, perhaps a check for pot control.
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Old 04-13-2014, 03:03 PM   #6
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Re: 1/2 Disaster

As played, I think you have to call this off. Villain probably has enough AX diamond draws that your ahead of to justify calling. Plus, villain may have put you on a pocket pair after you bet flop and thinks they are ahead with AX even without a draw, and an outside chance of a smaller flush draw or a bigger pocket pair that thinks your bluffing.

Like everybody else, I'm not betting this flop. Hero is OOP, has to beat the shove to make money anyway, an over pair isn't folding to one bet and the pot is already big so betting them out will be expensive. I think that is really the only mistake you made here though, and it isn't terrible if you think the range for the guy who shoved has some worse hands in it.
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Old 04-13-2014, 05:47 PM   #7
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Re: 1/2 Disaster

I would like the say my flop bet was an attempt to ISO the shove since I was unable to on the flop.

But in reality, this was a completely mindless Cbet.
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Old 04-13-2014, 06:51 PM   #8
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V's range: {A3, A5, 33, 55, 53, AK, AQ, AJ, A10, AXdd}

I think we can eliminate all underpairs at this point.

Do you think the villain would float with AK, AQ, AJ, A10? Probably not considering A) It's a sidepot and B) he has a bet and call in front of him.

So this leaves 33, 55, 53, A3, A5, and AXdd. All of these make sense for a call on the flop.

Now the turn brings the ace and Hero bets out again. It's now clear to V that Hero has a hand and he can extract some value, so he shoves. I would argue that he would not be too thrilled by your bet with AXdd and would only call. However I do see him shoving with AKdd and AQdd. Maybe AJdd.

This is a fold.

Last edited by JJ!; 04-13-2014 at 06:59 PM.
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Old 04-13-2014, 07:28 PM   #9
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Re: 1/2 Disaster

Preflop: Fine.

Flop: You are bluffing into an empty side pot. This is a bad mistake. Even if UTG is spazzy enough that you think your A high is a value bet against him, you still have to cut through two players who from your description are not people you want to bluff here. Tight/passive grandmas don't limp/call 3bets with non-big hands. Bad LAGs are not only tough to bluff, but are capable of coming over the top of your bets.

This is a 100% clear cut check. If there's a bet check/folding is best, although check/raising as a bluff is defensible. This is the key street of the hand.

Turn: As played, even though the board is very coordinated I would check/call. I'm not so worried about giving free cards to draws here because calling the flop with backdoor diamonds and calling preflop and the flop with hands that contain a 4 or a 2 seems pretty unlikely for your opponents. By checking you may trick the LAG into bluffing with a hand like 77 that he would probably fold if you bet. Also, by checking you keep the pot smaller in case you are behind.

Other turn plays are defensible, but again, your takeaway from this hand should be to not bluff into empty side pots. Check the flop.

Just my opinion...
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