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1/2: Best Table Conditions, Best Flop, Line Check 1/2: Best Table Conditions, Best Flop, Line Check

07-04-2017 , 09:51 AM
Smallish casino in smaller town. So for 4 hours we are playing 4 handed w/o any obvious fish (maybe I was the fish?). All of the sudden, we are 7 handed playing 1/2, with 2 new fish to the table who are each >600 deep. This is about as good as I've ever had it.

V1 (750): MAWG who gives off a bit of a redneck vibe. Made a hero call with middle pair in a spot where he probably should have folded. Then a couple hands later hit a boat and GII against the nut flush. Not super aggressive but seems to like calling down when he gets a piece of the board.

V2 (300): 55ish white guy, a bit tighter and a decent player for 1/2. I folded to his check raise earlier and I'm getting the vibes that he thinks I am a young aggressive kid.

V3 (625): 35ish white guy, drinking, has made comments that he came here to gamble and won't be pushed off hands, which is corroborated by his actions. I flopped the nut straight earlier and after I smooth called his flop bet, raised his turn bet, and bombed the river, he still called me down with what I think was TPMK.

Hero (800): 30ish white guy, to these 3 Villains who recently sat down, I've been slightly on the active side, and won some pots w/o showdown. Only significant hand I won that went to showdown for these 3 was the straight I flopped against V3.

OTTH... V3 button straddles, V1 calls from SB, V2 calls from BB, Hero makes it 25 with 55. Folds except for the 3 villains.

Flop (95): AT5 V1 checks, V2 checks, Hero bets 45. V3 folds, V1 calls, V2 calls.

I've realized that my sizing is frequently too small and though I think I'm getting better, I think maybe this was too small as well. I'm obviously targeting an Ace or flush draw so maybe 75 would have been better?

Turn (230): AT5 6 V1 checks, V2 checks, Hero bets 110. V1 calls, V2 calls.

Again while this is probably a decent sized pot bet, I'm thinking 150ish is probably better

River (560): AT5 6 Q V1 checks, V2 checks. Hero??

Looking for thoughts on all streets.
1/2: Best Table Conditions, Best Flop, Line Check Quote
07-04-2017 , 09:56 AM
with that crew make it 90 on the flop...seriously, i play with a ton of lunatics that hate folding more than gangrene
1/2: Best Table Conditions, Best Flop, Line Check Quote
07-04-2017 , 09:58 AM
dude, on the turn say "all in" put an end to their madness i bet you lost to a flush there lol what madness
1/2: Best Table Conditions, Best Flop, Line Check Quote
07-04-2017 , 10:20 AM
Pre-flop raise is dubious, you want to see a flop for cheap, why let yourself be blown off it

Flop sizing is awful, smaller sizing isn't always bad but on this texture and multiway its way too small, bet at least $20 more.. you want to be thinking about playing for stacks on turn or river with your hand so that should influence your sizing

Turn sizing is also way too small, look how awkward stacks ended up for you on river, as played I think you should go about $180-200

River, not an easy spot but I would go for some value here and maybe fold to a raise, you described v1 as prone to hero calls so 150-350 could get paid off, shoving feels awkward
1/2: Best Table Conditions, Best Flop, Line Check Quote
07-04-2017 , 10:44 AM
I wouldn't be raising this hand preflop against a bunch of calling stations.
Flop and turn bet sizing need to be much bigger.
River-I also think there is value in betting. I would bet around $180 and fold to a raise.
1/2: Best Table Conditions, Best Flop, Line Check Quote
07-04-2017 , 10:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by monikrazy
Pre-flop raise is dubious, you want to see a flop for cheap, why let yourself be blown off it
I'm normally somewhere in the middle of the eternal "always raise pre" vs. "limping is okay" 2+2 debate, but here I want to play for stacks if I hit my set (even though I was stupid and ended up sizing too small my flop and turn bets) and given how deep we are I'm not sure that is happening with a limp ... Not sure what you mean by "let yourself be blown off it". I've described these villains as more loose passive than anything so I don't think we are too worried about that.

Curious what others think about the PFR?
1/2: Best Table Conditions, Best Flop, Line Check Quote
07-04-2017 , 11:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joey913
I'm normally somewhere in the middle of the eternal "always raise pre" vs. "limping is okay" 2+2 debate, but here I want to play for stacks if I hit my set (even though I was stupid and ended up sizing too small my flop and turn bets) and given how deep we are I'm not sure that is happening with a limp ... Not sure what you mean by "let yourself be blown off it". I've described these villains as more loose passive than anything so I don't think we are too worried about that.

Curious what others think about the PFR?
I don't like the raise. Raising with baby pairs is great if it can sometimes win the blinds, and if you can reasonably c-bet bluff when you get a caller and get a flop you can represent.

Here, you know you are never stealing pre, and know you are getting called on most flop bets. That means you only win when you have a set.

And against fish, you can likely get stacks in or near to it when you hit your set anyway, without the raise.

So here, the PFR has downside (facing a big raise, or whiffing the flop and not being able to bluff) and limited upside (sets get paid anyway).

The bet sizing is near criminal unless you were trying hard to induce a raise by looking weak. These players should be very inelastic, so take advantage.
Especially given your pre-flop strategy, your goal on the flop should be to get it in on the turn or sooner.

AP, bet 350 river. V2 is short, would likely shove if he hit the river, and near committed to a call. V1 will call so much of his range at that price that it is worth the risk that he hit. The sick decision becomes what happens if V2 shoves over top of you.
1/2: Best Table Conditions, Best Flop, Line Check Quote
07-04-2017 , 02:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevyn
And against fish, you can likely get stacks in or near to it when you hit your set anyway, without the raise.
Really? So if hero limps, we go to the flop with a pot of $18. Can you explain how we can get our $750 effective stack in by the river against a loose passive player? Are we betting 2x pot on every street? If so, even fish can smell something fishy with those kind of bets.
1/2: Best Table Conditions, Best Flop, Line Check Quote

      
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