Villain is solid TAG, very active from LP (opens 80% of buttons) and has fired two barrels on most non-sd pots which were then folded to Villain on the turn.

eff stacks 220

UTG+1 limps, MP2 limps, Villain on button raises 16, Hero in SB Q9 calls (preflop leak), calls, all fold.

Flop: (46)
Q98

Hero leads for 35, Villain min-raise to 70.

...what next?

...hypothetically, what if position is reversed, and Hero leads 16 w/ Q9 on button, flop play is Villain c/min-r?

Basically looking for info on playing 2-pair OOP vs. IP, esp. facing a flop raise on a slightly wet board.

With these stacks you are committed to the hand, shove.

In position if he check raised my flop bet I would shove. Stacks are to short to fold top two pair on a board that has so many semiblufs/draws.

Hand would be much harder if the stacks were a little larger.

I don't understand why you led this flop? This is probably the most imbalanced aspect of every SSNL live players game, they flop a decent hand, and they do something unorthodox.

You need to think about a few things - mainly: How does my flop lead impact my perceived range. Secondary, what do you think your opponents raising range and calling range are if you shove?

I say fold. Never lead on a connected board and never call a minraise unless your drawing to the nuts. Reason being your opponent is strong. He could have a set or a straight.

If you had the nut flush draw I would call reevaluate on the turn.

get it in

Semi bluffs are profitable due to fold equity. When villain min-raises you here, he's repping a big hand, and giving you almost irresistable odds to call. So the only fold equity he has is if he knows that you'll pick up on this bet size, and will give him credit for a made straight or set. So having said that, i wouldnt give many LLSNL villains credit for being able to pull a move like that on you unless they know you and have played with you for a significant amount of time.

If he had something like QJ, QT, J9, T9 or even 98 i'd imagine his bet would be somewhat larger. For this reason his range seems fairly polarised between nuts and air, and id say its more heavily weighted to the nuts.

Youre not too pot committed. Fold, and kick yourself for playing Q9 OOP IMO

I would fold preflop. Very marginal hand, putting in over 7% of our stack preflop OOP in what could easily end up being a HU pot vs what sounds like an aggressive non-straightforward villain, meh.

Is this 3way or HU? HU I probably always check/raise here, but even 3way here I probably check/raise if villain can be counted on to bet this flop.

As played, we've flopped top two pair in a raised pot; methinks pot / stack sizes are such that we can't ever fold. The minraise could be a "where am I at raise" which is intending to fold. There's not a lotta scare cards (really only a J/T). If we call, the pot will be $186 and we'll have $134 left. I think I just call and then ship the turn.

GcluelessNLnoobG

this is aweful advice. We have top two on a coordinated board in a straddled/raised pot. This is a very easy shove. And technically we are drawing to the nuts.

Fold Pre

Do you follow me around the forums?

What is wrong with my advice? Leading with 2pair on this board is meh at best. If you get shoved on you have to call. This board is very dangerous for 2pair. You can argue for a c/r not a donk bet. This spot op should c/c flop. Shoving 2pair is a recipe for disaster.

If you think a Q or a 9 is a real draw? A real draw to me is 8 or 9 outs to the nuts.

preflop is bad you are not deep enough to make this call

I like the way you played it on the flop though if you shoved.
I don't know how leading can be bad here esp if villain is agro and is going to spaz out with all types of hands when hero donks into him.

Actually I was looking at this thread and saw you suggesting folding top two pair in a multiway straddled/raised pot. This is an awesome spot for a donk bet. Plenty of weaker one pair and pair/straight draw hands will call, and plenty of over pairs can+will raise. Effective stacks are like 55 big blinds makes this hand very easy to play.

Everytime I call a minraise with top 2 on a connected board. The villain always has a straight. Idk man minraise kinda scares me from terrible players.

Sounds like Villain's range is very wide here. Folding is terrible. I probably worry a little about 44 and JT but Ship it in with Top 2 and 4 outs to the nuts.

How deep do stacks need to be before this becomes a reasonable play OOP? Or is it just never reasonable? FWIW Hero covers in this spot.

You have top two, in this pot do you really give him a range of only sets and straights? The range I would assign and have seen played by this type of villain is FAR larger than that. The fact that you have only 55 bb folding is a -EV for sure.

It's not just about stack sizes. You describe villain as a solid TAG; a solid player is pretty much the last guy we want to play with OOP with a crap marginal hand (especially since he's aggressive and is going to put us to lottsa tough decisions postflop for a large percentage of our stack). I mean, if it was for 2% of the effective stack, sure, ok, let's see a flop and get lucky. If the guy is a horrible payoff monkey straightforward no bluffing fish, sure, let's see a flop for 5% of the effective stack. But 7% of effective stack with meh hand OOP against a solid player? I assume there's going to be easier ways to make money at the table.