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Raise turn with a one-card St8 Raise turn with a one-card St8

07-12-2019 , 09:18 AM
3/6 Live limit.

I am on button with AT 2 limpers to me, I raise. BB and limpers come along. Four to the flop. (8sb in pot)
Flop comes 8 J 7
Checked around to me. I bet. Everyone calls. (6bb)
Turn 9
Checked around to me. I bet, BB check raises, MP folds, LP cold calls two.
I ...
Am I raising or calling here?

[SPOIL] I call turn. River is a 2. BB bets out. LP calls. I call.

BB declares "Anyone got a 10?" and shows two pair. LP mucks.

I usually play promptly, but the turn decision stumped me. I just kinda froze for a bit. I couldn't convince myself to 3-bet there, but I thought I should be reraising?! [/SPOIL]
Raise turn with a one-card St8 Quote
07-12-2019 , 10:44 AM
I’d check the flop four ways.
Raise turn with a one-card St8 Quote
07-12-2019 , 11:35 AM
flop bet or check is ok. turn is fine.
Raise turn with a one-card St8 Quote
07-12-2019 , 11:45 AM
"I'd check the flop four ways."

Could you share your reasoning for that? Too many people? The board too coordinated? Pot too small?

I assume straight draws and people who made a pair on the flop come along for my flop bet, but can I get any Ax, Kx or Qx hands to fold? And if so, does my EV even increase enough to make it worth it?

Would this be something where if I plugged it in to PokerStove I would get some better clarity?
Thanks for the feedback.
Raise turn with a one-card St8 Quote
07-12-2019 , 01:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NittyOldMan1
flop bet or check is ok. turn is fine.
Disagree with flop bet. You have little equity and no one is folding. This flop connects so hard with limpers range. Guys, stop auto betting flops multiway in small stakes without solid equity, you never take it down and getting check raised is a disaster!

Unless I have a read that turn check raiser is super timid I 3!. There's only one hand that beats you.

Also please don't include spoilers.
Raise turn with a one-card St8 Quote
07-12-2019 , 04:09 PM
Thanks for the feedback. Thought my error was not raising turn; never thought the major leak was betting that flop. Lots to learn.

So,
Check the flop: four way and flop hits the limpers range hard.

3 bet the turn against basically everyone but the most timid of players.

Spoilers suck.
Raise turn with a one-card St8 Quote
07-12-2019 , 06:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by reaper6788
Disagree with flop bet. You have little equity and no one is folding. This flop connects so hard with limpers range. Guys, stop auto betting flops multiway in small stakes without solid equity, you never take it down and getting check raised is a disaster!

Unless I have a read that turn check raiser is super timid I 3!. There's only one hand that beats you.

Also please don't include spoilers.
dont forget about getting a free card on the turn by betting flop esp in a passive game where nobody raises without at least two pair. its really really valuable to see all 5 cards with this hand

i honestly think betting or checking are about the same EV here. now if the limpers were aggro then i think checking is much better. obv if we were in the blinds this is an easy flop check.

Last edited by NittyOldMan1; 07-12-2019 at 06:28 PM.
Raise turn with a one-card St8 Quote
07-12-2019 , 06:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PrGarland
never thought the major leak was betting that flop.
its not a major leak if a leak at all

you pumped up the pot preflop so its worth something. try to win it by seeing all 5 cards. also if you check the flop you give license on the turn for any pair to bet making you potentially fold 10 outs.

also i guess you can 3 bet the turn but if so you better have a plan if you get 4 bet.
Raise turn with a one-card St8 Quote
07-13-2019 , 08:35 AM
Hmmm... I don't see the problem with betting the flop, although I agree getting check-raised stinks. I certainly wouldn't lead at it, if I were early, but as button, I personally think it's fine.

You have a back-door nut flush draw, a runner-runner nut straight draw, a gut shot, and an overcard, though I don't know how good it is. All together, these add up to a decent number of outs. Game speed, I'd estimate I had the equivalent of seven outs, discounting the ace pretty heavily. And some of the draws are nut draws.

You're betting 1:8, then with the callers you get 1:11. I'll take 1:11 (or 1:8) with that bet from the button, although again, getting check-raised is a real possibility and trashes the plan.
Raise turn with a one-card St8 Quote

      
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