20/40 9 handed....Time game

Two loose passive players limp in MP, Bad lag raises in CO, folded to me. I have 7h9h. BB is average reg.

Are we on the button or in the SB?

Either way, I'm folding.

SB.

Call

I’m folding.

I can't make up my mind therefor 'toss-up.' Lean fold a bit bec it's a time pot.

We pay time every half hour.

OK, I took it as a time pot. I change my answer to 'call.'

I would call in any of the remaining possible positions.
There's no way this is a loser otb in a 5-way pot, and with a discount in the blinds I don't think you should fold there either.

For those of you who say call, is this a close decision? Tell me when to stop...8h6h? 7h5h? 6h4h?

All of those are auto-calls in the BB to me so w/o doing any math my gut says that if it's wrong to call in the SB it can't be all that bad. Worst case is BB 3-bets and it comes back 4-bets and then a fold is prob correct. But you say BB is average which discounts that scenario so, the heck w/ it, it's too nitty to fold, imo.

+1 although I fold them all in the sb

You can't walk away +5 racks by folding, yo.

Ppssssssshhhhhhhhhhhh, easey peasey. First, start with 10+ racks.....

I would play 64s and fold 53s.
Play T7s and fold 96s.
Play J7s and fold T6s.

I'm pretty loose in these spots though.

Same hand, slightly different scenario. I'm in a very loose-aggressive $6/$12 game, 10-handed. There is a lot of three-betting and capping preflop. A couple of players seem to like to three-bet pre every time there's a raise to their right. (I saw one of these laggy openers show down 45o after three-betting pre.)

There's a raise and a three-bet in early position from two of the usual raisers. Two or three middle position players call. The cutoff calls. I'm on the button with 7d9d. I fold reluctantly. I would like to play this hand on the button in a multiway pot, but not for three or four bets.

(The flop brings two diamonds. The turn is a diamond, and the river is another diamond. The CO wins a massive pot with 8d3d.)

What the flop is. It’s irrelevant.

Calling four bets cold with 79s is a long term loser.

How aggressive are they on the flop?

You can't walk away with five racks if you fold after it's 4 bets back to you

I would definately call. It's not like you fear domnation. If it gets capped it is probably by the wide range lag who may check back some flops giving you a free look. Now that we are here, this is a great spot to gamble.

It's 3 bets too him. If I chose to play this, I would cap.

Munga brings up a good point regarding post flop aggression. The more Things mello out post flop, meaning I won't have to pay as much to get there the more I'd be inclined to play.I'd also look at the implied odds of the situation. If a bunch of these folks are gonna pay me off when I get there I'm more inclned to play. plus just think how fun it would be to cap, flop well, get tons of action because they think you have AA's as you proudly announce you have a straight. Their reads of you being a nit will be forever crushed.

putting in 3 bets cold or 4-betting (cap or not) all seem horrible with 97s. I'm trying to construct loose enough ranges that could make this right -- I guess if HJ opens ATC, CO knows this and 3! 50%, then you're 30% hot and cold with favorable IO and probably dead blind money, but the extra preflop bets also obliterate much (probably not all) of your IO.

Yep. This right here

This is true if we are getting involved with this hand in 3 bet pots often. However, getting involved once in a while, especially given the described line up can't be that bad. Doing this with 56s or 67s seems fine maybe even standard. Doing this with 79s is gambly, but I'm ok with it.

I'm assuming this is going to be in a huge mw pot and not in a 3 or 4 handed situation.

It sounds like you're saying we should throw this in as a semibluff for balancing or "advertising value" or whatever, and yet a huge multiway pot is where those things have little value. People generating multiway pots may think "He's awfully tight," but they'll also think "I just know he has AK so a pair of treys is probably good." Regarding advertising, I do think doing this once in a blue moon just to show up at showdown can actually be good for image. Humans have a hard time distinguishing between 2% of the time and 20% of the time so you get more credit for tricky play than you deserve.

But that's not exactly what you're saying. I certainly don't think playing for 3 bets cold (maybe putting in a 4th) is standard with 76s. In fact, it's horrible. If I'm wrong I hope a bunch of good players will pile on, because if I think something is very bad when it's marginally good, this must be revelatory of a SERIOUS leak in my game.

I could see playing JTs or T9s like this rarely if you have a deliberate deceptive purpose to it. Domination is somewhat worse there but the multiway pot makes domination less relevant. But usually you're just burning bets for deception against unobservant or theoretically bad opponents.

I don't disagree with what you're saying in general. I am only responding to the OP and it's description and number of players involved and the fact that we are on the button. Winning poker is about limiting mistakes and not straying to far from the correct play.....with a sprinkle of Gamble!

This is a spot that doesn't come up often. I may not even pull the trigger when it does. If you don't want the variance you should fold. If you don't mind it you can make a gamble once in a while. As mentioned, this can be great for your image those times you get to showdown. I get it, we won't be getting to showdown often, but when you do it sticks with the other players and creates some long term confusion.