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17 to 1 fold 17 to 1 fold

09-22-2020 , 12:12 PM
Decent TAG opens UTG (sometimes he fools around with 67s and such here), nit 3 bets a few seats over, TAG in small blind caps, and I call the big blind with QQ.

Flop is KKJr and the small bind bets.
17 to 1 fold Quote
09-22-2020 , 04:57 PM
Is this 9 handed? Even if so, I still call once to see what happens. It's possible sb can have AQ/TT/other QQ that just mindlessly cbets and the nit could have those hands also. Not super likely but at 17-1 it doesn't have to be. Also, when you're behind and the queens are live, you're only 19-1 to spike the turn plus implied odds if you do.
17 to 1 fold Quote
09-22-2020 , 05:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrazyLond
Is this 9 handed? Even if so, I still call once to see what happens. It's possible sb can have AQ/TT/other QQ that just mindlessly cbets and the nit could have those hands also. Not super likely but at 17-1 it doesn't have to be. Also, when you're behind and the queens are live, you're only 19-1 to spike the turn plus implied odds if you do.
9 handed.
17 to 1 fold Quote
09-23-2020 , 04:43 AM
I feel like this is a clear fold. Our "17:1" is super fake since there can be more action behind us. We will need to fold if it goes raise-3bet, and we will need to fold turn against any normal action. The problem is that the TAG in the small blind might have a range as gross as JJ+ and AK (especially once he bets) with the nit's being TT+ and AQ+. Great pot odds don't mean much when we are crushed by the SB alone with 2 players behind us who have plenty of raising hands.
17 to 1 fold Quote
09-23-2020 , 07:42 PM
If this is game I've played with Ninefinger recently, UTG & SB TAG range is wide.

Not sure who Nit is though.

Id call flop fyi.
17 to 1 fold Quote
09-24-2020 , 12:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by maka2184
If this is game I've played with Ninefinger recently, UTG & SB TAG range is wide.

Not sure who Nit is though.

Id call flop fyi.
-1.

I'll make best effort basis to never question Unguarded who is right close to 100% of time . Now that Ninefingershuffle was kind enough to spoil me who was in hand via PM, I think range for Nit is closer to a TAG in my biased opinion in my experience.

UTG and SB range is still wide though based on action provided by OP and my personal experiences
17 to 1 fold Quote
09-24-2020 , 01:16 PM
Everybody involved in the hand who could raise has raised. All four players' ranges are uncapped, including hero's (their only options were to call or fold).

My naive thought was that hero is at the bottom of their range here, and can comfortably fold.

But before the flop hero was getting 10:3 in immediate odds for their call, with prospect for getting as much as 15:3 if the other two players call. UTG should be calling with almost all of their range, and the nit would have to be truly nitty to fold anything they are 3-betting with. Even given that it is tough to realize equity out of position, we only need 16.7% in realizable equity to call, and that suggests a remarkably wide range.

That said, everything Unguarded said is true. It's limit holdem in a multiway pot that was capped preflop. If SB's flop bet isn't raised by someone, everyone at the table should be kicked out of the union.

The 17:1 odds the pot is laying the hero right now is illusory; it is going to be 10:1 at the very best and quite likely to be 7:1. We are not getting the right price to peel and try to turn a Q, and we virtually certainly do not have the best hand now. I would fold and not lose any sleep over it.
17 to 1 fold Quote

      
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