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12-05-2008 , 08:36 PM

#26

Dagger78

old hand

Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 1,708

Quote:

Originally Posted by chattambi

I understand & respect your opinions and KNOW them to be superior play in the long run. But, here's why I'd still STRONGLY consider not raising with JJ from BB.
The games I play are uber-passive &wtf-reraise-ive! Even AKs & high pairs are limping hands preflop! What they like to do is limp reraise! If I raise, I am doing the betting for them. In a weird way, I am actually magnifying their mistakes by NOT raising preflop in this situation!!!
This has forced me to cut down my preflop aggression to the most profitable situations. JJ in BB in family pot is not profiable enough to raise, imo. coz the position & passiveness postflop doesnt allow me to drive out anyone from staying in till the river, the infinity & beyond. I get sucked out.

Again, this is specific to the games I play. I understand your point of view and wonder if it could be modified to my situation.

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 14.411% { 22+, A2s+, K8s+, Q8s+, J8s+, T8s+, 97s+, 86s+, 75s+, 65s, 54s, A2o+, K9o+, Q9o+, J9o+, T9o, 98o, 87o }
Hand 1: 14.409% { 22+, A2s+, K8s+, Q8s+, J8s+, T8s+, 97s+, 86s+, 75s+, 65s, 54s, A2o+, K9o+, Q9o+, J9o+, T9o, 98o, 87o }
Hand 2: 16.566% { 22+, A2s+, KTs+, QTs+, JTs, T9s, 98s, 87s, 76s, 65s, 54s, A9o+, KTo+, QTo+, JTo }
Hand 3: 16.568% { 22+, A2s+, KTs+, QTs+, JTs, T9s, 98s, 87s, 76s, 65s, 54s, A9o+, KTo+, QTo+, JTo }
Hand 4: 12.000% { random }
Hand 5: 26.047% { JJ }

Here's the equity calculation. I included two loose limpers(37% of hands), two tighter limpers(25%) and the SB whose range is any two.

Our equity with JJ is 26% and we're putting in 16.67% of the money. By raising we increase our equity i the pot from 1.56 SBs by checking, to 2.12 SBs by raising.

Quote

12-05-2008 , 09:46 PM

#27

leo doc

Most interesting man on 2p2

Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 12,132

Quote:

Originally Posted by ruken

JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range
JJ is favorable to their range

What's your point?

Careful, junior. There are mods lurking about and foolishness isn't suffered long.

Quote

12-06-2008 , 03:22 AM

#28

chattambi

centurion

Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 101

Quote:

Originally Posted by leo doc

Wanna raise next time?

Heck, I might even limp (to encourage more limpers) & reraise JJ against late position aggros.

Last edited by chattambi; 12-06-2008 at 03:23 AM. Reason: laugh

Quote

12-06-2008 , 03:27 AM

#29

chattambi

centurion

Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 101

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dagger78

Thanks, Dagger

Quote

12-06-2008 , 01:52 PM

#30

ruken

old hand

Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 1,765

Quote:

Originally Posted by leo doc

What's your point?

Careful, junior. There are mods lurking about and foolishness isn't suffered long.

Mai ballz. I got my point across without all that silly maths stuff.

Quote

12-06-2008 , 05:39 PM

#31

leo doc

Most interesting man on 2p2

Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 12,132

Quote:

Originally Posted by ruken

Mai ballz. I got my point across without all that silly maths stuff.

lol. who needs math in limit, anyway?

Quote

12-06-2008 , 05:46 PM

#32

Hair_of_the_Dog

journeyman

Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 357

I'm not looking for the standard answer on any of this so if you think this is below you don't answer. I know what the standard play is preflop. You can look that up easily.

Hero raises...(14 sb)
Flop 865 rainbow (1 of our suit)
SB checks
Hero ?

Quote

12-06-2008 , 08:19 PM

#33

Tirppa

veteran

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 3,325

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hair_of_the_Dog

Is this a trick question?

BET!

Quote

12-07-2008 , 12:01 PM

#34

Dagger78

old hand

Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 1,708

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hair_of_the_Dog

Bet and hoped to get raised.

Quote

12-07-2008 , 02:28 PM

#35

Hair_of_the_Dog

journeyman

Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 357

No tricks. Just play along.

Quote

12-08-2008 , 10:51 AM

#36

BeakWetter

old hand

Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 1,489

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dagger78

I don't raise 22-99.

Sorry, don't mean to Hijack, I was away from comp all weekend.

With 6 Limpers I do raise any pp near every time.

Don't have stove at work so don't have %s with me... but even if we are a slight dog I am ok pushing a slight -EV situation here to get Laggy image working for me.
I can certainly guess at the main reasons against raising 22-99, but what are your thoughts.

Quote

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