Two Plus Two Publishing LLC Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > >

Notices

Micro-Small Stakes Limit Discussions about micro-small stakes Texas Hold'em (all stakes up to around 15/30)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-25-2017, 01:35 AM   #26
Aaron W.
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Henderson, NV
Posts: 27,879
Re: .50-1 -- FSDR???

Quote:
Originally Posted by jdr0317 View Post
I really don't understand why we're assuming this villain is FSDR'ing.
My read of the post is that OP was asking "What do I do if he's FSDRing?" I read it this way because he basically asks that question: "What is the exploit for a player who occasionally FSDRs, other than to continue to try to play my best and let them value-own themselves from time to time?"

Quote:
This is a spot where he can raise for thin value. Then when the river completes flushes and 76, he can't expect AB to call with his A hi hands, so he checks.
And this returns to the question of how he responds to a 3-bet when he's raising for "thin value." Are we putting pressure on mediocre hands to fold? And how much equity is he folding when he folds?

Quote:
If he makes raises like this frequently, we can start three betting the turn more.
I will say that from my perspective, the tipping point was that villain's two pair/trips outs are all in play. Often, when you have an overpair to the paired board, the opponent's two pair outs are no good against you. But the ace is an overcard to your overpair, and so those outs are still live. This makes his equity significantly larger (basically double) and making him fold right away has an increased value. (The preflop 3-bet matters here, too.) This makes 3-betting in this spot much more correct if you think villain is FSRDing.

I remain somewhat insistent, however, that 3-betting this as a *general* approach is a bad idea with your weaker showdown hands. You have relatively little to gain and a lot to lose, and this makes the risk/reward ratio on stepping out much more difficult on you. Being out of position sucks sometimes because you can't do as much as you can do in position. C'est la vie.

You should be wary of expanding that 3-betting range too far because of that. The last thing you want to do in a spot like this (imo) is to have the tables turned on you where you're now the one raising a mediocre hand and facing a raise (or cap) and now you've got an ugly decision to make.

For me (and I've said this many times ITT), I'm getting to showdown with this hand, but I don't want too many extra bets going in. If you're 3-betting, you should do so with the intent of showing this down even if things go sideways on you and he caps/bets the river. If you can't stomach that, don't 3-bet.

Such a move reminds me of the 3-bet/fold discussion with a straight from this post: https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/1...aight-1684354/
Aaron W. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-25-2017, 06:02 AM   #27
AlanBostick
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
AlanBostick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Value Town (Pronouns: he/him)
Posts: 8,870
Re: .50-1 -- FSDR???

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron W. View Post
My read of the post is that OP was asking "What do I do if he's FSDRing?"
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlanBostick View Post
What I want to know is how to interpret the villain's play, and if any adjustment is appropriate.
Captain R's latest post is awesome, an example of the best this forum has to offer.
AlanBostick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-25-2017, 11:44 AM   #28
callipygian
slowrolled by tpiranha!
 
callipygian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: but I don't know which
Posts: 18,299
Re: .50-1 -- FSDR???

I also want to point out that Alan is generally aware of the importance of posting results, which is why his post is entitled "FSDR???" and not "FSDR!!!"
callipygian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-25-2017, 11:55 AM   #29
Aaron W.
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Henderson, NV
Posts: 27,879
Re: .50-1 -- FSDR???

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlanBostick View Post
Captain R's latest post is awesome, an example of the best this forum has to offer.
I agree, and I'm also a nit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlanBostick View Post
Quote:
My read of the post is that OP was asking "What do I do if he's FSDRing?"
What is the exploit for a player who occasionally FSDRs, other than to continue to try to play my best and let them value-own themselves from time to time?
Aaron W. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2017, 05:04 PM   #30
BobC
enthusiast
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 93
Re: .50-1 -- FSDR???

FSDR? What's FSDR?
BobC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2017, 06:51 PM   #31
AlanBostick
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
AlanBostick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Value Town (Pronouns: he/him)
Posts: 8,870
Re: .50-1 -- FSDR???

"Free Showdown Raise," i.e. raising on the turn in the hopes that the river will check through.

It was fashionable among players ten years or so ago, but as a tactic it doesn't stand up to scrutiny through the lens of game theory.
AlanBostick is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:40 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2008-2010, Two Plus Two Interactive
 
 
Poker Players - Streaming Live Online