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Old 08-26-2008, 06:47 PM   #4976
fiammaz
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

Pokerace, players are angry because PT3 team, try to convince them that fixing the HUD is hard, programmig is hard ect. C'mon guys, you have problems?Fine, think about them and how to resolve em. In 3 months you don't realize that, maybe, and just maybe, some good programmers will have speed up the improvement process. You decided to not do then, players complain about it.
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Old 08-26-2008, 06:48 PM   #4977
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerAce View Post
I will admit that we dropped the ball here, but we are working on rectifying the situation and I believe, for some reason or another, we received much more flack than any one of our competitors would've received if they were in our situation. I don't want to get into that again, but that is my opinion. I just hope that some of our naysayers will actually try the next version and give us a chance at making things right.
I was probably one of the hardest people on Roy when HM was released but then I tried it 2 weeks later and it was like night and day. I guess I just don't understand why it's taking so much longer for a lot of your customers to get the same service especially since you guys were unquestionable industry leaders for so long with PT2. And FTR i'm not trying to plug HM in your thread just letting you know where i'm coming from.
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Old 08-26-2008, 06:50 PM   #4978
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

Beta 16 have HUD bugs?
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Old 08-26-2008, 06:54 PM   #4979
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerAce View Post
You also need to remember that with each beta release, the number of users affected have been reduced,
The number of users affected stayed exactly the same for the reason I stated above.
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Old 08-26-2008, 06:55 PM   #4980
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by fiammaz View Post
Pokerace, players are angry because PT3 team, try to convince them that fixing the HUD is hard, programmig is hard ect. C'mon guys, you have problems?Fine, think about them and how to resolve em. In 3 months you don't realize that, maybe, and just maybe, some good programmers will have speed up the improvement process. You decided to not do then, players complain about it.
The quality of developers isn't a problem here, it was a lack of man power. Unfortunately, finding quality developers that can be trusted to work from home is a time consuming process, not to mention the time we would've taken to train and get them caught up to speed with everything. It would've just slowed things down even more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by _Towelie_ View Post
I was probably one of the hardest people on Roy when HM was released but then I tried it 2 weeks later and it was like night and day. I guess I just don't understand why it's taking so much longer for a lot of your customers to get the same service especially since you guys were unquestionable industry leaders for so long with PT2. And FTR i'm not trying to plug HM in your thread just letting you know where i'm coming from.
Some people *did* see a fix in the first two weeks. I'm sure you follow the HM thread. There are still people posting Hud bugs there, and they've been out for 7 months now. Again, I'm not putting down HM, I'm simply saying that this situation isn't uncommon and certainly isn't isolated to PT3.
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Old 08-26-2008, 06:57 PM   #4981
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerAce View Post
The quality of developers isn't a problem here, it was a lack of man power..
Nice, there it is, what I thought. You got it, anyway it's your fault, you should hire someone to help
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Old 08-26-2008, 07:12 PM   #4982
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

Wow you guys are sure hard on the PT guys. Sure they made a mistake releasing the product as a beta but they surely arn't loosing any business. HM is by far the better product now but down the road it's very likely that PT3 will be the manager of choice. I planned to buy both as needed and the small price for the features these trackers contain is so minimal.

If your unhappy with PT3 now give HM a try and come back to PT3 when the issues are resolved.
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Old 08-26-2008, 07:40 PM   #4983
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by fiammaz View Post
Nice, there it is, what I thought. You got it, anyway it's your fault, you should hire someone to help
For most of PT3's development life cycle, we had no income coming in from it. I don't know of any developer who would've worked for an indefinite amount of time without having any sort of income from their work.

After release, adding more developers would've been the absolute worse possible thing for us to do. It's not like other jobs where adding more people makes the job go faster. With software development, adding more developers ends up slowing progress down tremendously for a while before it starts picking back up, especially when you're dealing with things like this (debugging existing code).

Once things are stabilized, as they are becoming, it becomes easier to add on additional developers, and that's what we're going to do.
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Old 08-26-2008, 07:43 PM   #4984
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

It's really only a troll or two repeating the same thing in multiple forums.

PT3 is great for post session analysis at this point and PT2/PAHUD work perfectly as usual in the meantime. I haven't tried the PT3 HUD while playing aside from some layout setup time at the penny stakes but it seemed to work fine. I only had a few tables open though so who knows how it would work with 20 open. The penny games were ridiculously fun though.
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Old 08-26-2008, 10:01 PM   #4985
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by ncboiler View Post
The bugs affect EVERY SINGLE POKERTRACKER USER. This is because you guys are spending all of your time fixing bugs which delays new releases, which conceivably, should contain additional features.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncboiler View Post
The number of users affected stayed exactly the same for the reason I stated above.

ncboiler, in case you are wondering, your posts are indeed getting through and appearing for other users.

Regards.
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Old 08-27-2008, 12:27 AM   #4986
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerAce View Post
For most of PT3's development life cycle, we had no income coming in from it. I don't know of any developer who would've worked for an indefinite amount of time without having any sort of income from their work.
PT3 has been released commercially for months. You have said that PT3 is the market leader so I'm guessing as the market leader you made a nice buck with the initial release. You could have paid an additional developer with that money.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerAce View Post
After release, adding more developers would've been the absolute worse possible thing for us to do. It's not like other jobs where adding more people makes the job go faster. With software development, adding more developers ends up slowing progress down tremendously for a while before it starts picking back up, especially when you're dealing with things like this (debugging existing code).
PT3 is still missing many features that PT2 had. A new developer or two could have been working on these features or even the "new" features you have mentioned in the past while you were fixing bugs. If you come back and say that bugs were so deep that a developer couldn't work on new features while you were making changes then your "solid" foundation that you spent months talking about wasn't so "solid".

Also, if you write decent code and have a good database design then it wouldn't take long to get a good competent developer up to speed and have him start adding new features.
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Old 08-27-2008, 02:21 AM   #4987
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

I just wish the HUD stats were able to be manipulated, like you can do w/ PAHUD. I don't like that layout at all and would like to put them where I want them on the layout. Is it possible this will be changed in the future?

edit: and why the hell doesn't the damn thing open when I click it? Just a frozen screen for 30 seconds
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Old 08-27-2008, 06:38 AM   #4988
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by otter View Post
I just wish the HUD stats were able to be manipulated, like you can do w/ PAHUD. I don't like that layout at all and would like to put them where I want them on the layout. Is it possible this will be changed in the future?

edit: and why the hell doesn't the damn thing open when I click it? Just a frozen screen for 30 seconds
Simply right-click and drag to move your stats to your desired location, then click the PT icon -> save layout to save. What is it that doesn't open when you click on it?
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Old 08-27-2008, 05:28 PM   #4989
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

Up until this point we've had a "no refunds" policy on PokerTracker 3 purchases because of the fact that there is a very generous trial version available that can be used for nearly two months before expiring. However, we have decided to amend this policy. The new refund policy for PokerTracker 3 is as follows:

  • If you have a problem after you purchase that is preventing you from using PokerTracker 3 (with restrictions), we will give you a full refund of your purchase price.

    Restrictions
    • Your purchase must have taken place within 60 days of approaching us with your complaint.*
    • Your purchase must have originated from the PokerTracker website. Purchases made through other methods must contact that party instead (the other restrictions here still apply).
    • You must allow a remote assistance session with one of our support technicians to determine if the problem is a configuration/computer problem, or if the fault lies within PT3. A computer problem is not eligible for a refund.
    • If it's a bug in PT3, we have two weeks to remedy the problem.*
    • The problem must be preventing you from using PT3 or an otherwise major inconvenience. Minor glitches and inconveniences have a lower priority than major problems and aren't eligible for refunds.
      • Major Problem: The Hud crashing several times an hour.
      • Minor Problem: Slow imports/retrieves, or a bug in the sorting of a report.


Basically, what it boils down to is if there's a problem that is keeping you from using PT3 and we can't resolve it in a reasonable amount of time, we will refund you. It is our hope that this new policy will improve our relationship with our customers - past, present and future. We certainly don't want anyone to feel cheated because PT3 will not work for them. Our goal from this point on is to make sure all of our customers are happy and that we resolve problems as quickly as possible.

Please note that if you received a discount on your purchase and you request a refund, you will not be eligible for another discount if you decide to purchase again in the future.


* Until September 30, 2008 the 60 day purchase restriction doesn't apply, and we have until that date to fix any outstanding issues preventing PT3 from working.
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Old 08-27-2008, 05:30 PM   #4990
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

Beta 16 Released

Added:
  • Trial extension: 60 days
  • Cache to improve Hud performance
  • Table opening for TableTracker (Full Tilt, Party and PokerStars only)
  • Database Housekeeping. Replaces the old way of
  • clustering/vacuuming/analyzing
Changed:
  • Hud: Config window should now popup in front of windows and is now centered on the screen rather than the table.
  • Hud: New drawing method, should be much more efficient and less resource intensive
  • PokerStars observed tables can now only import 30 hands per session (30 minutes required between sessions before new hands can import) REQUIRED BY POKERSTARS
  • Export: Groups hands by table, and in order (improves speed when re-importing)
Fixed:
  • Hud: Crashes
  • Hud: iPoker tournaments not being recognized
  • Hud: iPoker showing lifetime stats of Hero after sitting out
  • Hud: iPoker tournament tables not being recognized
  • Hud: Stats remaining on screen after table closes
  • Import: Everest 6/2 max limits
  • Import: Some tournament import issues with dates
  • Import: Rare continuation bet problems
  • Import: flg_x_has_position
  • Import: Party hands with invalid dates will no longer import
  • Report: Cache preventing certain filters from working
  • TableTracker: Displaying multiple entries for single player in table list

I know it's been a long time coming, but there have been a lot of changes since the last release. Hud performance and stability has improved dramatically. This was accomplished primarily with two changes:

1. A new drawing method
2. Introduction of a cache

The new drawing method reduces the resources that the Hud uses and makes a huge difference when you have many tables open. The cache reduces the resources used by PostgreSQL when you have very large databases. The combination of the two means that no matter how large your databases are or how many tables you have open at one time, PT3 should have little problem working for you now. I'm sure there are still some problems remaining, but they are hopefully now few and far between. If you experience a little bit of lag, try disabling logging. PT3 logs a lot of information and that can cause some resource usage as well.

Important Cache Information
In order to use the cache, you need to update it. You do this using the new Housekeeping feature, which replaces the old cluster/vacuum/analyze functionality. The new housekeeping feature allows you to cluster, vacuum, analyze and update the cache on one or all of your databases. You just tell it which actions to perform on which databases and it does them all for you without any further interaction from you. Keep in mind that the housekeeping actions can be time consuming and doing them all on a lot of large databases can take a tremendous amount of time. Also, if you haven't defragged your hard drive recently, you may want to do so after clustering and vacuuming, but prior to analyzing and updating the cache. Defragging before clustering may help, but the act of clustering and vacuuming may fragment your hard drive. At any rate, it should speed up the caching process.

TableTracker Table Opening
Also in this release is the ability to launch poker sites and open tables directly from the TableTracker interface. The table opening functionality is still a little basic and only works on Party, PokerStars and Full Tilt. We are working on adding support for the other sites PT3 supports and will have that to you as soon as we can. We will also be improving the interface, making it much easier and more useful and adding some highly requested features.

Other Points of Interest
The cause of the slow importing of exported hands has been found. It wasn't really a bug, but rather a problem with an optimization not being utilized. When PT3 imports, it keeps session information cached in memory so that it doesn't have to query the database after each hand to determine if the session information is already in the database. This only works when hands from a single session are in close proximity of each other. With the export, PT3 would not keep the hands in any particular order, so when importing, PT3 would have to constantly query the database for session information. Unfortunately, there's nothing that can be done to improve the speed of existing exported files, but in this version it groups the hands together by table, so this should not be an issue with exported hands in the future.

A few of the annoying non-crashing, non-lag Hud problems have also been resolved. The Hud should appear without issue on tournament tables. It should also never show your lifetime stats (by not realizing you're the hero at the table). The stats should always be consistent between the table stats and the popup stats as well.

Some of the import problems have also been fixed. The problem with Everest 6 max tables is fixed. Tournament dates issues have been fixed. Problems with continuation bets and the flg_[street]_has_position column has been fixed as well. Unfortunately, to see these changes, hands must be purged and re-imported.

Trial Extension
We've decided to extend the trial period again with this beta version. This version will give you an additional 60 day trial to test PT3 if you haven't already purchased it.

The Future
I'm pretty confident that this release will fix the majority of Hud problems, so it's finally time for us to move on to other items. Our overall plan is to fix the remaining bugs and then bring PT3 up to par with PT2 in terms of features missing. That is our main priority, in addition to a few more TableTracker features. From there, we will add more site support and additional features that don't exist in PT2. These features should be added fairly quickly, so expect releases more often. If you have submitted a bug report support ticket and have not yet received a reply and this version doesn't fix your problem, do not despair. I plan on fixing a lot of the minor problems that have been submitted for the next beta.

We appreciate those of you who have been patiently waiting for fixes. We understand it's frustrating and admire those of you who can handle that frustration in a constructive manner. Thank you. I hope that we will make your patience pay off.
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Old 08-27-2008, 05:32 PM   #4991
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by fiammaz View Post
Beta 16 have HUD bugs?
I have used some of the test updates (5 or 6, so far) since Beta 15 was released. I was having SIGNIFICANT and NUMEROUS problems with Beta 15. There have been several updates, each reducing problems as new versions were released (one of them introduced new issues and I had to revert to the previous version). I have tested the latest version (the one I believe Poker Ace is referring to) for two days and have yet to experience any of the isssues previously seen. So .... my personal response is "not that I have found so far".

With the variety and frequency of errors and problems that I was experiencing, I think the PT3 team has actually made significant progress.
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Old 08-27-2008, 05:33 PM   #4992
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

Please see our new State of PokerTracker post.
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Old 08-27-2008, 06:01 PM   #4993
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

Sweet. Updating cache right now.
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Old 08-27-2008, 06:12 PM   #4994
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

mod please edit the title of thread to reflect beta 16.


*edit* thanks, that was quick.

Last edited by Fermion5; 08-27-2008 at 06:22 PM.
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Old 08-27-2008, 06:16 PM   #4995
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

I just bought a new computer, and am using 64-bit Vista Ultimate as my operating system. Two questions:

Is there anything I need to know about installing PT3/Postgres?

What would be the best way to get my database from my old computer... is there a way to actually move the databases, or should I just export all the hands from them and import into new databases on this computer?
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Old 08-27-2008, 06:30 PM   #4996
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by DMoogle View Post
I just bought a new computer, and am using 64-bit Vista Ultimate as my operating system. Two questions:

Is there anything I need to know about installing PT3/Postgres?

What would be the best way to get my database from my old computer... is there a way to actually move the databases, or should I just export all the hands from them and import into new databases on this computer?
I personally run Vista 64 Ultimate and haven't had any issues whatsoever. I do know though that some people running Vista have had issues running PostgreSQL 8.3.x and that they've had to use 8.2.x instead. The easiest way to move your databases would be to either export and reimport your hands or to backup your database following these instructions.
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Old 08-27-2008, 06:30 PM   #4997
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by DMoogle View Post
I just bought a new computer, and am using 64-bit Vista Ultimate as my operating system. Two questions:

Is there anything I need to know about installing PT3/Postgres?

What would be the best way to get my database from my old computer... is there a way to actually move the databases, or should I just export all the hands from them and import into new databases on this computer?
Turn off UAC, if the version of PostgreSQL that comes with PT3 doesn't work for you, get 8.2.9 and install it manually (PostgreSQL 8.2.9).

For backing up your database:

Start --> Programs --> PostgreSQL --> Command Prompt

at the command prompt:
Code:
pg_dump -Fc YourDbName > YourDbBackup.tar
You need to put in your database name as YourDbName, and please note if you have spaces involved you need to put quotes around it "PT3 DB" for example.

To restore:
Code:
pg_restore -Fc YourDbBackup.tar
on the new machine.

This method will compress the output some which should be nice, the downside is you need to do each database separately.

If you aren't sure about your database names you can either find them in PostgreSQL (S->P->P->psql to template 1, at the prompt type
Code:
\l
) or you can find them in PT3 in the Database Management window.

ETA: Well my colleague, typing less, got in there faster . . . doing it manually this way though will compress the backup which may or may not be useful for you
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Old 08-27-2008, 06:43 PM   #4998
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 16 available) - 27-Aug-2008

log files sent etc
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Old 08-27-2008, 06:48 PM   #4999
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 15 available) - 21-July-2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jehaim View Post
Sweet. Updating cache right now.
I tried it on a small databse first and it kept saying "0% complete" but then all of a sudden it was done,
so it keeps saying 0% complete while its 20 or 50% complete.
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Old 08-27-2008, 07:56 PM   #5000
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Re: New Software: PokerTracker 3 - 3.00.2 (Beta 16 available) - 27-Aug-2008

So, I update, do a full house keeping. I log onto stars, open 9 tables and start importing; after a few minutes it's painfully obvious that the stats are going to only show up on 1 table. I've never had a problem like that. So, I close all the tables and PT3 Build 16. I startup again, open 9 tables and PT3. I now get no Hud after a few minutes, so I try and stop hud and the application stops responding. I kill the app and the tables again. I try again and now it's working; yes the drawing changes make remarkable changes in cooperation with other apps and poker client windows.
hope those problems were just a one time deal.
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