newb question. I am at a final table, only 6 ppl left. 63 people were paid total in this specific tourney. If i am looking at a hand though from the FT, 6 handed, it is not necessary to put in prize amounts that have already been paid correct?? so setting up a hand, 6 handed, i only need to input the top 6 prizes eh?

well, now that i am at ICMizer website, attempting to input the prizes it asks for participants and buyins. well, if i only put 6 participants and then add the prize pool numbers, i am going to have to jack the buyin up super high (total prizepool 1-6/ 6 remaining players)to get the buyin.

if i do it by percentages - I will fall short of 100% if i only input the top 6 prizes, unless i add up the top 6 prizes and calculate each prize by the total prizes paid 1 through 6.

Perhaps it will be easier if i input the entire prizepool (64 prizes paid) and buyin, this would be all information.

sorry for any confusion, i should be able to figure this out myself but how would u approach this?

what i did, was the following, would this give me correct results? I added up the top 6 prizes (6 players left). i then divided each prize by the accumulated total of prizes 1 through 6. Then i input each prize in the "custom payout" as a percentage - hope you follow and would this give me correct results??

the following looked like this:
1st = 36.571%
2nd = 23.6143%
3rd = 15.8634%
4th = 10.6932%
5th = 7.61005%
6th = 5.82805%

would this be correct, could i set it up as such?

Why am i getting the following error?? the situation is as follows: i open utg (6 handed) to 17,812 at 4000/8000/800 (i input this as a custom blind structure). the guy immediately behind me calls, and the guy immediately behind him shoves AI. I want to look at some variables in this hand but am having trouble setting it up. Hero is utg and it says invalid spot: heros bet is bigger or equal to other players bet, please change position so hero can push or fold. why is it saying this??

Hey. To get correct calculation results for FT you need to have payout structure which does have payouts before last 6 places. It is irrelevant how they are distributed, but it is important because top 6 places get paid a certain % of prize pool which is NOT 100% of prize pool. If you create a payout structure with 6 payouts only, it will have 100% of prize pool for 6 players, and you will get wrong results.

The solution is, use percent mode, then once 6 places are entered, hit [Done] button. It will create some fake irrelevant payouts up to 100% payout, so you will be getting correct results for your FT calculation.

Well, because in this spot hero raised, and other players did nothing. There is no push or fold decision facing hero yet.

The situation you describe though is analyzable. You just need to add actions for those 2 guys. Edit action for first guy and make it call of your raise, and edit action of second guy to make it a push.

Then the situation will be analyzable.

This would be the incorrect approach. The Evs for hands will be incorrect, because the fact that tournament had many more payouts than 6 , and a big part of prize pool has already been distributed is not taken into account in this approach. Please refer to my advice above with [Done] button in payout creation window.

i really appreciate the feedback Q, got it done just like you said and this will serve me well in the future. One question now: if u look at the screenshot why is the HJ say raise 17812 instead of call?? is it the same thing??? it says call 8800 for HJ or raise 17812 when i have already indicated an action for me, hero, utg. what do you make of this screenshot, something seems off here.

Important thing is to have the actual bet next to respective player. Problem is that sometimes its easy to say, what it was, that is how exactly certain amount of chips ended up in front of player.

If its equal to BB for example, he limped and there are no other options. However if there is more chips and more players, it can be impossible to say the precise sequence of actions. For example someone couldve limped 1 bb, another raised 3bb, and first player called 2 bb. Now they both have 3bb in front. That could be a result of first player raised, second called 3BB though.

So just ignore names of actions in more difficult spots, make sure that chips in front is actually equal to spot where hero was facing a push fold decision.

Hey Q,

Following the latest update stars hh's won't load into the program? Any idea why?

Thanks (L)

Hey buttonclicker.

Generally from what I can see in logs PS histories are being loaded.
Could you contact me via email support@icmpoker.com and send some PS hands which fail to parse?

I always treat parsing problems as highest priority but I need some sample hands.

Is there an option to pay via Pokerstars?

Also, any discounts for returning subscribers? ) I've been out of action for a while.

Hey, unfortunately atm I cannot offer any payment methods outside paypal or credit card.
Note that you can ask your friend to make a purchase for you, and to send you the purchsed activation key.

Regarding discounts, no there are no discounts for returning subscribers. I always send my love and ask the poker gods for an upstreak to any returning subscriber though! Gods are especially generous if he resubscribes for a year!

Hi Q,

Thanks for your last response it was very informative.

Now I have a question regarding different ranges being calculated when I change the Hero position. Below are two screenshots of what the SB shoving range should be if Button folds. In each case I am clicking "Calculate FGS Nash Equilibrium" and then clicking "Calculate FGS":





In one situation the shoving range is 24% but in the other it is 17%. Why is this?

Could you direct me to a video or a part of a video which discusses when and when not to click "Calculate FGS", after one has already clicked "Calculate Nash Equilibrium"?

A second issue I have regards calling/shoving ranges vs 3bets. I vaguely remember seeing a video where you discussed this, but I have difficulty finding that video (or part of the video when it is very long). Could you direct me to them?

please how do I import a HH (tournament) that I received by email from PokerStars?

sorry my english

ty

This is because of how Nash Calculation algorithm works. The calculate button is always precise, while Nash Calculation tries to find closest approximation.

This is a popular question, so I have an article which is specifically about this question:
http://www.icmpoker.com/en/blog/anal...sh-fold-spots/

It will answer all your questions about this particular behavior.


There is no such video. But generally the recommended sequence of actions is : Set up Hand -> Calculate Nash (with or without FGS of your choice, according to spot type) -> Edit some ranges manually , cause players don't play according to Nash usually -> Hit Calculate (with or without FGS again), to get the precisely calculated hero range.

Some people avoid 3rd step for some reasons (which I can't say is a correct thing to do), so they just go Import hand -> Calculate Nash (FGS) -> Calculate (FGS)

But I STRONGLY recommend editing ranges manually, always. At least some of them.

Hey Vlad.

Generally you are supposed to be able to simply import it using [Paste hands] button.

If something doesn\t work, please send me an email to support (you can write in russian) with a file attached, and I'll see what is up with that.

Thanks,
Q

Hi Q,

Thanks for the article, but something still confuses me. I understand that if there is a big difference in ranges after pressing the "Calculate FGS" button compared to just pressing the "Calculate Nash FGS", then it means the spot is not stable and it is hard to determine what to do with the "in-betweener" hands.

I also understand that if you edit calling ranges of opponents, then you need to press the "Calculate FGS" button to account for those changes.

From what I understand, if everyone is playing Nash (which I understand is rare), then simply pressing the "Calculate FGS Nash" button gives you the Nash shoving range for that spot.

But then why should I press the "Calculate FGS" button to get the appropriate shoving range (assuming I don't change any of the nash-assigned ranges)?

If everyone is playing nash, what is the correct range to shove, the one before or after pressing the "Calculate FGS" (considering I have already press the "Calculate Nash FGS" button)?

I understand your quesiton, and that article is supposed to answer it.
The ranges in Nash solution are "correct" since that is best approximation to Nash equilibrium.

The precise range you get when you hit calculate is "correct" because it is precise, and it takes all opponent ranges into account. However if you perform a precise calculation for many players, you will modify many ranges from initial Nash solution, and you will end up with something which is less stable, than initial Nash solution, because all ranges will be farther from the Nash equilibrium approximation now.

Its rather complicated topic and it may be really hard to understand (or I have a problem explaining it). What is important for the player though, is that the actual detail here is not that important for your game. What is important, is that the change which happens in range, isn't dramatic, it may remove or add a few non important hands with EV difference which is close to zero. So it really makes little difference to your overall strategy profitabilty, how you choose to play those hands.

You won't be exploited if you do either (fold or push them), so worrying about it is really unnecessary. Focus on hands with clear +EV or -EV, which are present in both Nash approximation and precise ranges, those are the hands which clearly have to be played in one profitable way.

Hey Q,

Thinking of purchasing a one month subscription to start through PayPal. My question is, when the first month subscription ends, do i need to renew month-to-month or will my PayPal be automatically charged until such time I decide to cancel the subscription?

Thanks.

Hey demoneyez.

All subscriptions are not auto-renewing. So you don't need to worry about losing your BR to those annoying renewals which we all forget to cancel sometimes.

I can also recommend trying out at least 3 month subscription, because if you dont like the product you can cancel it during first month of using and get a refund.

I'm not sure what's going on, but somehow I now am getting different results using the exact same stacks and everything as I was before. I just have no idea what's going on. I'm assuming I've unknowingly changed some setting but I don't know which one. The payout is identical - 65% first, 35% second.

Here is a screenshot I took a while ago of a hand:


And now I tried doing the same calculation and got different results. I always click Calculate FGS Nash Equilibrium and then Calculate FGS:


I've noticed that all my previous calculations give different results now. What do you think could be going wrong? And which is the correct result from the two above images?

Also, can I make a PS transfer to pay for a year subscription? I assume you accept VISA otherwise?

frankrowley0808, I am not sure what was wrong or who is wrong, but I checked right now and I got result from the first screenshot for FGS.

The second screenshot is what I get for Nash calculation without FGS.

I can see that checkbox is checked, but maybe something weird has happened. I have checked server logs and didn't find any suspicious activity. Please let me know if you experience this error again, and please record the time of error if it happens.

Regarding payment: I can only accept credit card and paypal at this time, two options which are available at official purchase page. If you wish to do a PS transfer, you could ask a friend to buy ICMIZER in usual store, and send you the activation key.

Maybe im missing something but arent HEROs holding different on both pictures? On the one on the top HERO´s holding AK and the one on the bottom is pocket 77s

In the first screenshot the push range is 80%, in the second it is 90%.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using 2+2 Forums

Thats the issue @frankrowley0808 is trying to explain, same spot same stacks (but not the same hand) and he´s running nash ranges so if everything is the same and u click on nash it should give u the same results