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Old 01-25-2021, 10:02 PM   #6876
TenHighCallDown
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

ANOTHER FEATURE SUGGESTION:

For nodelocking the "Select in Range Explorer" option isn't terribly useful when you want to bet certain hands somewhere between 0% and 100%.* Any sort of functionality where you can set a percentage to bet different hand types would be very helpful.

Having entire hand types play in a totally binary way isn't useful for me, so I end up forgoing the "Select in Range Explorer" function altogether.

*I guess technically 50/50 is an option if you select them in both Bet and Check.
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Old 01-26-2021, 07:45 AM   #6877
punter11235
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

Quote:
https://imgur.com/a/APBwDi8

Hello,
what does it means?
When you make a small save (flop + turns) then rivers are cut from the tree.
This makes the save much smaller. It's always fast enough to browse even on rivers because the solver is able to recalculate rivers on the fly while you browse them. Unfortunately calculating line frequencies require averaging on all possible runouts which would require recalculating of the whole tree which is not feasible (as that would take about the same time/memory as solving the tree from scratch).

Quote:
Any sort of way to make the Range Explorer exportable. I'm not programmer, but it seems like it would be easy to include in an aggregated frequencies analysis. I've attached an example of how the data could be included in an aggregated frequency analysis:
No way to do that right now but it might be something we are interested in doing in the future.

Quote:
ANOTHER FEATURE SUGGESTION:

For nodelocking the "Select in Range Explorer" option isn't terribly useful when you want to bet certain hands somewhere between 0% and 100%.* Any sort of functionality where you can set a percentage to bet different hand types would be very helpful.

Having entire hand types play in a totally binary way isn't useful for me, so I end up forgoing the "Select in Range Explorer" function altogether.

*I guess technically 50/50 is an option if you select them in both Bet and Check.
Yes, I agree this interface is hard to use.
We already have improvements in dev. Hopefully we can release them soon.
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Old 01-27-2021, 01:53 PM   #6878
ChunkHoarder
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

When looking at a preflop range (3bet for example), how do you know whether it is raise/call or raise/fold?
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Old 01-28-2021, 02:05 PM   #6879
pippola3
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

I bought an additional edge activation. It's been more than 24
hours, but I haven't received anything yet. I have tried to contact support by email, but have not received a reply. Anyone know how I can contact support in another way?

Thanks
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Old 01-29-2021, 05:14 AM   #6880
punter11235
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

Quote:
When looking at a preflop range (3bet for example), how do you know whether it is raise/call or raise/fold?
You have to navigate to the next node (the opponent raises) and see the strategy there.
Quote:
I bought an additional edge activation. It's been more than 24
hours, but I haven't received anything yet. I have tried to contact support by email, but have not received a reply. Anyone know how I can contact support in another way?
I am sorry, I am late answering emails lately. There are are so many of them.
The reason you haven't got an additional activation yet is that your email address in the order doesn't match your registered one so the script wasn't able to add it automatically.
I will answer your and other emails today (starting right now).
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Old 01-29-2021, 10:29 PM   #6881
PierreNormand
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

PioUpdater doesn't run anymore on my Windows 10 computer. The process is being killed by Windows Defender.

When I double click the file PioUpdater.exe, it it keeps creating new PioUpdater processes that are being immediately killed by Windows' process Antimalware Service Executable. I am unable to kill PioUpdater.exe myself in TaskManager because the process keeps being created repeatedly, sometimes in multiple instances, and killed within half a second. I have to restart the computer or sign out in order to stop the loop.

I tried adding exceptions in Windows Defender. I was unsure if I needed to add an exception for the process "PioUpdater", "PioUpdater.exe" or for the file "PioUpdater.exe" (with complete path), so I added all three as exceptions. It didn't have any effect. PioUpdater still is still being prevented from launching by Windows Defender. No virus warning is offered. The process is just being killed.
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Old 01-30-2021, 12:22 AM   #6882
SchruteFarmsPA
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

Hey Punter, I noticed that when I changed my RAM configuration it deactivated my license, and consequently the re activations count against my overall deactivation count. Surely this can’t be normal or reasonable? I sent email on this a few days ago to support as well. Thanks for the assistance.
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Old 01-30-2021, 02:27 AM   #6883
punter11235
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

Quote:
PioUpdater doesn't run anymore on my Windows 10 computer. The process is being killed by Windows Defender.
This is strange, a lot of people run it without problems.
We had a bug in the updater at some point that causes it to enter the infinite loop sometimes. Can you please try downloading a fresh/new one from here:

https://piofiles.com/download/Updater/PioUpdater.exe

The reason it creates new processes is that it tries to update itself first.

Quote:
Hey Punter, I noticed that when I changed my RAM configuration it deactivated my license, and consequently the re activations count against my overall deactivation count. Surely this can’t be normal or reasonable? I sent email on this a few days ago to support as well. Thanks for the assistance.
Yeah, don't worry about it. We can always increase the limit. It's there to prevent the license being used as a floating one. There won't be any problems extending the limit.
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Old 01-30-2021, 07:05 AM   #6884
Curacao
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

Hi, can i set PioSolver to calculate only a limited number of turn subsets from a given flop,
and what type of subcription is needed?
Thanks
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Old 01-30-2021, 12:31 PM   #6885
HeyMaeena
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

New to Pio, need some help/an explanation please. For a BTN vs. BB tree I just did for a given flop, the flop IP betting and checking frequencies differ greatly (from ~50% bet to ~20% bet) depending on whether I give OOP a turn bet size. Why is this? Shouldn't it be the same?
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Old 01-30-2021, 01:29 PM   #6886
PierreNormand
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

Quote:
Originally Posted by punter11235 View Post
The reason it creates new processes is that it tries to update itself first.
Problem solved. Thank you so much. I didn't have any problem in the past; so I'm unsure why it started acting up all of a sudden. But now, the new updater works without a glitch.
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Old 01-31-2021, 04:08 AM   #6887
punter11235
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

Quote:
Hi, can i set PioSolver to calculate only a limited number of turn subsets from a given flop,
and what type of subcription is needed?
Thanks
This is not possible.
Quote:
New to Pio, need some help/an explanation please. For a BTN vs. BB tree I just did for a given flop, the flop IP betting and checking frequencies differ greatly (from ~50% bet to ~20% bet) depending on whether I give OOP a turn bet size. Why is this? Shouldn't it be the same?
In general you need sensible options anywhere in the tree because otherwise it might be possible to exploit lack of option. For example if your opponent can't raise you would be willing to bet way more than normally.
With OOP turn bet size it's like this. If IP checks back the flop then OOP can't bet (not size) so IP gets an option to check back flop and see both turn and river for free.
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Old 01-31-2021, 05:57 AM   #6888
HeyMaeena
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

Quote:
Originally Posted by punter11235 View Post
This is not possible.


In general you need sensible options anywhere in the tree because otherwise it might be possible to exploit lack of option. For example if your opponent can't raise you would be willing to bet way more than normally.
With OOP turn bet size it's like this. If IP checks back the flop then OOP can't bet (not size) so IP gets an option to check back flop and see both turn and river for free.


Thank you


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Old 01-31-2021, 06:04 AM   #6889
tese
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

A strange thing happens to me:
i'm running a script but at some teture (i think 9s9d9c, TsTdTc) it happens that the exploitable threshold goes back and forth and the script goes for hours and hours without ever completing.
Here is an example screen, stop calculation set to 0.3%:



I have already tried to restart the pc, completely delete the script files and restart it, but it always crashes on the same textures.
I specify that before now I have run hundreds of scripts without problems.
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Old 01-31-2021, 06:21 AM   #6890
punter11235
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

Quote:
A strange thing happens to me:
i'm running a script but at some teture (i think 9s9d9c, TsTdTc) it happens that the exploitable threshold goes back and forth and the script goes for hours and hours without ever completing.
Here is an example screen, stop calculation set to 0.3%:
Yeah, those flops are for some reason most difficult for our algorithm. There is a timeout field when creating a script just for this case.
Another thing you can do is to send the config to us (support@piosolver.com) so I can use it when testing algorithmic improvements.
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Old 01-31-2021, 08:26 PM   #6891
Sparkyyy
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

Any news regarding future updates? Are three way solves in the works or is a PLO solver in the works?
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Old 02-01-2021, 03:29 AM   #6892
punter11235
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

Quote:
Any news regarding future updates? Are three way solves in the works or is a PLO solver in the works?
Probably no PLO or 3-way solver anytime soon.
Probably a lot o improvements for the current solver quite soon.
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Old 02-01-2021, 10:21 AM   #6893
Sparkyyy
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

Quote:
Originally Posted by punter11235 View Post
Probably no PLO or 3-way solver anytime soon.
Probably a lot o improvements for the current solver quite soon.
Is the ability to change sizings then resolve the tree while keeping the rest of the node locks in also going to happen? Sometimes I decide to try different sizings but then I have to redo the whole thing then manually redo all the node locks all over again.
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Old 02-03-2021, 10:41 PM   #6894
jl121
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

What does the Maximum Spread parameter change?
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Old 02-04-2021, 03:46 AM   #6895
juggler97531
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

Quote:
Originally Posted by jl121 View Post
What does the Maximum Spread parameter change?
It's for spread-limit game. It limits the maximum single bet / raise to X chips.
It's a lot like limit poker, but you can use any bet smaller than limit.
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Old 02-04-2021, 12:39 PM   #6896
newbieguy
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

I have read there were 1755 unique flop boards, right ?

Do you know how many unique isomorph turn boards are possible ?
Same question for River ?

I ask here because I found this thread : https://math.stackexchange.com/quest...th-isomorphism
I could not find the answer to my questions in this post, but I think Kuba and Piotr are from Piosolver, right, so maybe you know how to calculate that ?
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Old 02-04-2021, 01:58 PM   #6897
punter11235
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

Quote:
I have read there were 1755 unique flop boards, right ?

Do you know how many unique isomorph turn boards are possible ?
Same question for River ?
The answer is right there in the thread you linked:

Quote:
1,13,169,1755,16432,134459
This means, 1755 flops, 16432 turns and 134459 rivers.
Please notice that this is calculated with an assumption that we deal all the cards at once.
In real poker though the order we deal cards in matters unless it's an all-in preflop.
For example As Ks Qs 2h is a different run-out than As Ks 2h Qs.
To calculate all possible strategically different run-outs you would need to go through all 1755 flops and then use the following table:

Code:
    static int rainbow_multis[] = {1, 49, 2352};
    static int mono_multis[] = {1, 23, 675};
    static int paired_multis[] = {1, 37, 1476};
    static int flush_draw_multis[] = {1, 36, 1429};
    static int same_rank_multis[] = {1, 25, 744};
This table tells you how many strategically different turn/river run-outs exist on given flop.
For example on a rainbow unpaired flop every turn card is strategically different hence there are 49 possible strategically different turns and then 2352 rivers (total).
Rest of the table is self-explanatory. I don't have the aggregated number on hand though to answer your question.
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Old 02-04-2021, 02:32 PM   #6898
newbieguy
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

Quote:
Originally Posted by punter11235 View Post
The answer is right there in the thread you linked:



This means, 1755 flops, 16432 turns and 134459 rivers.
Please notice that this is calculated with an assumption that we deal all the cards at once.
In real poker though the order we deal cards in matters unless it's an all-in preflop.
For example As Ks Qs 2h is a different run-out than As Ks 2h Qs.
To calculate all possible strategically different run-outs you would need to go through all 1755 flops and then use the following table:

Code:
    static int rainbow_multis[] = {1, 49, 2352};
    static int mono_multis[] = {1, 23, 675};
    static int paired_multis[] = {1, 37, 1476};
    static int flush_draw_multis[] = {1, 36, 1429};
    static int same_rank_multis[] = {1, 25, 744};
This table tells you how many strategically different turn/river run-outs exist on given flop.
For example on a rainbow unpaired flop every turn card is strategically different hence there are 49 possible strategically different turns and then 2352 rivers (total).
Rest of the table is self-explanatory. I don't have the aggregated number on hand though to answer your question.
wow, I didn't know it was so complex, thank you !

same rank means like 9h9c9s ?
if the board is both paired and there's a flush draw, is it {1, 37, 1476} or {1, 36, 1429} ?
if the board is both paired and rainbow, is it {1, 49, 2352} ?

Also, what if we want to calculate the number of isomorph runouts including Hero's holecards? For example, on the turn : 9h9c9s_9d_AhKh = 9h9c9s_9d_AsKs.
And on the River : 9h9c9s_9d_2c_AhKh = 9h9c9s_9d_2c_AsKs
do you know how I can calculate these numbers ?

Last edited by newbieguy; 02-04-2021 at 02:52 PM.
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Old 02-04-2021, 06:48 PM   #6899
poochie89
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

Feature request:
- Square size proportional to Combos

In the solution browser we can set square to proportional to weight, would be awesome and helpful to set it proportional to the amout of combos
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Old 02-05-2021, 04:35 AM   #6900
punter11235
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Re: PioSOLVER - postflop equilibrium solver for Holdem

Quote:
same rank means like 9h9c9s ?
if the board is both paired and there's a flush draw, is it {1, 37, 1476} or {1, 36, 1429} ?
if the board is both paired and rainbow, is it {1, 49, 2352} ?
Here is the deal: you ask a general poker math question, I take time to answer it now you take time to understand the answer and try to to work it out yourself.
Once you do that and you still don't know the answer to the above please ask again showing that you in fact made an effort and what you think the answer should be.
Otherwise it's one way street and it's really not that fun.

Quote:
Also, what if we want to calculate the number of isomorph runouts including Hero's holecards? For example, on the turn : 9h9c9s_9d_AhKh = 9h9c9s_9d_AsKs.
And on the River : 9h9c9s_9d_2c_AhKh = 9h9c9s_9d_2c_AsKs
do you know how I can calculate these numbers ?
I don't have those numbers on hand.
Quote:
Feature request:
- Square size proportional to Combos

In the solution browser we can set square to proportional to weight, would be awesome and helpful to set it proportional to the amout of combos
Isn't it the same thing? I am probably not getting it so please describe how you imagine it to work.
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