Punter11235,

Thanks for the suggestion, using "change_step 0.65" before running the solver has seemed to help with some of these SRPs. For clarification and to avoid future issues, do I need to initiate this command each time I run a new sim? I've been re-entering the command each time I run a new SRP sim. Also, if its not too difficult, can you tell me what this command is actually doing/changing? Just wondering out of curiosity.

Thank you for the help.

Has anyone ever rented a server? If so, where are the best places to look? Thank you!

Hey guys. Can anyone PM me with the PIO skype group? How can I get into this group?

I'm trying to look at a spot where we get check/raised on the flop and might want to develop a 3bet range, but for some reason instead of just making it 3x the raise, PIO is defaulting to call or shove. The stacks are deep enough that we can 3bet and it will be nowhere near the 67% pot threshold, so I can't see where I've made a mistake.







We bet 18, he makes it 63, why, given my setup, does IP not the have the option to make it 189?

Is it the newest version (1.10.19 for the solver)? If yes, can you please send us the script or at least the beginning of it (so it contains calculation for several trees).

It usually takes less than 24 hours but I was on business trip last few days and the support was slower than usual. Resetting manually should be the last resort. If you want to move the license to another computer you can deactivate it yourself, like here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Ozjfnatwms (question number 3)

and then install on another computer.

Unfortunately yes.

The solver has an internat mechanism to determine how difficult the tree is and choosing how fast it should move the strategies when it starts solving. Unfortunately this mechanism was implemented back in the day where not so many trees with many bet sizes were solved on regular basis (these days the solver uses less RAM which allows bigger trees and a lot of our customers got very powerful hardware) so it doesn't recognize all the difficult situations. It's safe to start using a smaller step but it might cause some trees (especially simple ones) to take longer.

Contabo/Online.net/OVH are the most popular options among our customers I don't know enough about their offerings to recommend something at this point.

We don't use Skype anymore as it's too limited and buggy. We use Discord, see here:
https://www.piosolver.com/blogs/news...ersion-1-10-18

Unfortunately it's not possible to see the full tree config on a screenshot. The way to share tree configs is to click "copy to clipboard" button and then pasting it here (preferably in [ code ] [ /code ] tags without the outside spaces or pasting it to pastebin.com and linking here.

There it is, thanks.

v 1.10.22.12

Will send the script to support, thank you.

Hi,
Sorry about asking an easy question. I haven't used the software for few years. If I get to the river and the range explorer shows some number of combos to flush with a flush on board in position, how do I check which flush combos it checked? Range explorer shows me all the combos of flush.

Hey guys, when i check for updates than i see this https://gyazo.com/ef2429365f480123ffce6e1db4783562 can some1 help me whit this? thank you

You can click on a bet here:
https://gyazo.com/1b2a4024906f737f363bf275bef88380

and filter for a flush here:
https://gyazo.com/c3274c5826a2298a21ad98221bcfa884

This way you can see combos it chooses for bet/check with filtered part of the range.

You need a new installer/updater from here:
https://piofiles.com/download/Updater/PioUpdater.exe

This is because we've changed the whole distribution system (personal links are no longer needed).

We don't support reselling licenses for reasons described here:
https://www.piosolver.com/pages/faq (point 8)

You will be scammed if you buy Pio from other license owners. It happened before and it will sadly happen again. There is absolutely nothing we can do about it and we won't help you if someone sells you a license and then requests the key back from us. We have to always honor the original's buyer requests and we don't have will, time or resources to police private deals between people we have no control over.

Are you sure?

European Court confirms the right to resell used software licences

A recent European Court of Justice (ECJ) decision has confirmed that organisations can resell "used" software licences, regardless of whether they were purchased in a physical form or downloaded from the internet.

In addition to opening up greater competition in the software market and allowing organisations legitimately to source additional software licences from the second-hand market (as opposed to from an authorised reseller), the decision also means that organisations may be able to make better use of the intellectual assets on their balance sheet.

The background
The case involved the US software giant Oracle and a German company, UsedSoft, which provides a means for Oracle's customers to sell unused licences. Under Oracle's licence agreement, Oracle's customers download computer programmes from its website, and then install that software on a server, which can then, in turn, be accessed by a set number of users (licenses were sold in blocks of 25 users).

Under European law, the licensor of a computer programme loses its right to control onward distribution of a copy of that programme when that copy is first sold in the EU. This is known as the principle of exhaustion.

Oracle sought to argue that this law did not apply to software provided by way of a download (as opposed to a DVD or CD-ROM), and that UsedSoft's service therefore breached the restrictions in its licence agreement preventing the licensee transferring its rights to a third party.

The Court's decision
The ECJ dismissed Oracle's argument, holding that the principle of exhaustion applied regardless of the means by which software is distributed.

The decision is good news for organisations that currently are tied to buying licences through authorised resellers, as the decision will provide an alternative, legal source of software licences. This competition may have an impact on the cost of new licences, as customers are given the choice of buying cheaper, used, licences through other channels.

There are some key points to note:

The decision applies only to software licensed on a perpetual basis - in other words licences that are not limited in duration (for example, for a fixed term or subject to payment of an annual licence fee). This means that the decision does not apply to licences subject to ongoing maintenance contracts, such as those under Microsoft's Software Assurance programme (which only become perpetual at the end of the Software Assurance contract).
The decision applies to the version of the software "as corrected and updated", which means it includes any patches or updates that the original licensee was entitled to, even if the relevant maintenance agreement has now expired.
The decision does not allow a licence to be sub-divided. So if a licence is for a block of 25 licences, you cannot resell only 10 of those licences. If, however, you pay a per-seat licence fee, you may be able to sell individual seats.
Once the licence has been sold, the original licensee has to delete the "sold" copy from the relevant device. It remains to be seen how software companies will audit compliance with this requirement.
Licences as an asset of the business
To date, many organisations have tended to view software licences as an expense, rather than count them as an asset on their balance sheet.

The confirmation by the court that it is legal to trade these licences on a second-hand market means that an organisation can put a value on those licences as it would with its other assets, such as property, IT hardware and office equipment.

Indeed, the decision may change the way in which those organisations that already include their software licences on their balance sheet do so, as this decision is likely to affect the level of depreciation applied to the licences. As an intangible asset that suffers no wear and tear, a one year old licence for a still current version of a programme arguably still has the same value as the cost of a "new" licence. The licence will only really start to depreciate in value when a new version of the programme is imminent.

The decision therefore allows accountants to reconsider how they treat software licences when looking at an organisation's assets. For organisations with extensive licence portfolios, this may have a noticeable impact on their balance sheet.

Will the decision change the way that your organisation deals with its software licences?
How does your organisation currently value its software licence portfolio? We'd love to hear from you in our anonymous online survey on how organisations value and exploit their intellectual assets. Click here to tell us what you think.

This only applies to unlimited user corporate like licenses not personal per computer licenses like ours.
It's quite obvious why as well: we wouldn't be able to police a situation where license was resold to multiple people (which happened already more than one time). You can google around for some commentary to this and later (2016) decision by ECJ.

We can't and won't prevent you from entering a contract with anyone else but if you get scammed your only resource will be to take them to court as we won't be able to help you as we are obligated to always respect original's buyers requests which include restoring the license on their computer.

We also have a support contract which only makes sense if there is limited number of requests for lifetime duration of the license. If the we were to provide support to potentially everybody in the world just because we sold one software license it would mean we need to charge for that.

Is it possible to view two nodes from the same tree in different windows? Or would I need to build and run the same tree twice in different instances of PIO to do that?

When this happens is the solution itself jumping around also or just the exploitability number?

Can we just ignore the "Exploitable for Xbb/100 hands" value when this happens?

You can click "zoom" button to open a separate window which is pinned to a chosen node in the tree. Other than that you can open the same tree in two instances of the viewer after making a save first.

What usually happens is the solution jumping around in a very (near 0% frequency) rare lines which makes it possible to exploit for more.

Probably. My understanding of what is happening right now is that the very rare lines jump around (because you play vs a very small range there which may be changing in volatile manner) and take time to stabilize. This is also why adding actions which will be chosen with near 0% frequency to the tree makes it more difficult for the solver to solve.

Just got PIO this week. It's very confusing to use. Any have tips? I've been running a few of the built-in functions like BB 3b vs BTN, 2b pots, etc. How do I run an IP 3b vs say UTG/MP/CO? I don't see any pre built-in functions and I don't know how to create that.

Have you gone through the quick start video? I go through setting up trees there. You need to set starting ranges and possible bet sizes for both players. This is all explained in the quick start video although editing sample configs should work as well.

When using PIOsolver, the solver process is terminating a lot for me when I browse a solution and get to the river. After that I can no longer browse the solution. I get the following error code:

Solver process died with error code -1073740791

Any way to avoid/fix this?

Thank you in advance!

Is it the newest version? It should be 1.10.19 for the solver and 1.10.22 for the viewer.
If yes, can you please send us the tree save (if it's a small save) or a tree config (so we can recalculate it and check).

Would be nice if there was a notification option once a script complete similar to how there is when a calculation is completed.

I have been thinking about getting this and playing around with it for fun, but I do have a few questions.

Earlier on in the thread there was some talk about this running better on Intel systems than AMD ones. That, however (2015), was before Ryzen. Was the reason for the worse performance due to AMDs Bulldozer line being substandard, or will the program's speed run in proportion to the IPC (instructions per clock) of each chip? i.e. if I have an 8 core intel chip running at 4.5 GHz and an AMD Ryzen Chip at 4.5 GHz and they have equal IPC performance will the speed be the same, or will it run faster on an Intel system all things being equal?

Is this only for heads up 6 max? Can I run sims with > 2 players?

How flexible is it with running open ended scenarios, and can I access part of other scenarios in the future? For instance what if I want to run a sim for all Axx flops. Is that possible? If sometime down the road I want a specific Axx flop can PioSolver access that situation from part of the sim that was run previously?

I see that 16GB of RAM is considered "plenty", but what is an example of a tree that would make 16GB insufficient?

That's in the plans. The way scripts are implemented today though it's a bit difficult to implement.
If you really need it you can wrap the script in a bat file and call some kind of sound playing or email sending program once the script exits. This requires a bit of work and probably at least minimal programming experience.

The reason was that pre-Ryzen AMD CPUs were very slow at what solver is doing. It's not longer the case with Ryzens. First gen was about 5% slower than Intel assuming the same frequency and number of cores and I suspect the difference is not only gone but probably in AMD's favor with the newest gen (although I don't have benchmarks yet). Considering that those CPUs are about 2x cheaper and they are not affected as heavily by security patches for recent side-channel attacks they are by far the better value today.

Only HU spots right now (you can insert ranges for something like BTN steal and solve vs BB though). If you need multiway you will have to wait a bit more.

Yes, you can run it for any subset of flops and save the results to browse later.

You can store the solution on disk. The way it works is that full tree saves are humongous but saves without rivers are of reasonable size (50x-150x less than the tree takes in RAM) so you can have thousands of them stored. When you load a save without rivers you can browse it as a normal tree. If you encounter a branch which is not saved the solver will recalculate it on the fly which usually takes 100-300ms (depends on complexity of the tree and accuracy settings).

Full limit Holdem tree with cap of 4 on all streets and donk bets possible on every street is around 12GB.
This 25bb CAP holdem tree with 3-4 bet sizes everywhere including 3 donk sizes is 12GB:
https://gyazo.com/b71a6516162e3b50d5d865a68aad67f7

This HU tree with 3bet sizes everywhere and almost full ranges (typical BTN steal to 2.5xBB vs call, 100BB stacks) is 17GB big:
https://gyazo.com/36fa19c61317b012f448b5cb825c3bd2

To make it fit under 16GB you would need to change to one donk bet size on the flop for example or run it on suited or paired board.

Please notice that normally screenshots are terrible way to share trees as not all tree-building options are possible to see and it's difficult to copy. We normally share tree configs instead (text which you can copy-paste to your PioViewer and build the same tree) but I am assuming you don't have access to a Pio license so that wouldn't be very useful to you.

What is the AMD 32 Core Ryzen Threadripper 2 2990WX benchmark? Have there been any faster benchmarks that you've heard of, and if so, by what machine?

Thanks for the responses. 2 more questions.

You say "If you encounter a branch which is not saved" does PS know to look through libraries of old saves or do I have to catalog and load them myself? In other words if I do run that "all Axx flop" scenario, and come back some time later and input a specific Axx scenario will it know to call back to that sim that has already been run and thus have results waiting, or will I have to load the file that contains the scenario I'm looking for?

Can it combine results? For instance you said "This HU tree with 3bet sizes everywhere and almost full ranges (typical BTN steal to 2.5xBB vs call, 100BB stacks) is 17GB big:
https://gyazo.com/36fa19c61317b012f448b5cb825c3bd2

To make it fit under 16GB you would need to change to one donk bet size on the flop for example or run it on suited or paired board."

Can I run one simulation that has suited boards, one that has paired ones, and then one that has non suited non paired and then combine the results into one set thus getting the results I want with <16GB of RAM?

It seems to me that Threadripper would actually hurt performance. This program has a 16 thread limit. The frequency of Threadripper cores is pretty low compared to some of the lower end Ryzen chips. Since you dont get the benefit of all of the cores you'd be better off to get a 8core/16thread chip with the best IPC you can get.

I just installed the edge version on a VM but it is taking a very long time just to start the simulation

the configurations of the VM are:
2 vCPU, 32 GB of ram
windows 7 x64, 90GB of HD

I installed PIO using pio installer and also installed framework 7.4.2

I used a VM in this same computer with the same configurations a few months ago, with only 16 GB of ram, and it worked pretty well, not sure what could be wrong this time

vm configurations:
https://gyazo.com/df982ad901873cf78e229dcdd9254997


simulation stage after 20 minutes running:
https://gyazo.com/17df2aa63a87d9e5ba4169d5c4b9d6f8

thanks in advance