Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > >

Notices

Commercial Software Discussion of commercial gambling-related / poker software & commercial graphics modifications

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-05-2017, 09:36 AM   #251
gtlol
enthusiast
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 73
Re: MonkerSolver

I have a situation where i raise preflop and i want to fix the bb response. i lock from clipboard the 3 bet then i lock the fold from clipboard but the 3 bet changes. How can i lock both without changing each other while leaving call unlocked?
gtlol is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2017, 01:02 PM   #252
MonkerWare
enthusiast
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 60
Re: MonkerSolver

Quote:
Originally Posted by lestro View Post
Would you recommend Intel over AMD for monker? Or it doesn't matter for the most part?
Yes, I would recommend Intel. I have no benchmarks whatsoever from AMD though, but I would expect performance to be worse with possibly the exception of ryzen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oskaris View Post
Hi

I think i will talk for many people but Can you change the range viewer part and make it more like PioSolver, and other solver pls?

Like a big dial with the range of fold call bet etc like pioviewer ?

Thanks sure you understand
I understand. This is on the todo-list but unfortunately not heavily prioritized. You can get charts (dials) of individual ranges by pressing the column headers in the table.

Quote:
Originally Posted by insanityisagift View Post
ok so are preflop solutions possible in plo?
So I can get a gto limping and raising(and folding) range in the SB vs the BB?
Is that possible?
How much ram and how many cores do I need approximately for this?
Yes, preflop solutions with constraints in the form of action reduction (specifying a game tree) and bucket abstraction (forcing similar hands to be played the same way.)

You select these constraints yourself to a large degree, so RAM requirements will vary heavily according to settings. It's not obvious how much RAM you need to produce accurate ranges in PLO, as there are no known full game solutions to compare with.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IsaacAsimov View Post


I'm not sure I properly understand this. I'm assuming these are percentages of a players stack? Does "Call committal threshold" mean when a player bets 60% of his stack, he is commited to calling a raise for example? Would "Fold commital threshold" then mean when another player bets 75% of an opponents stack, they are commited to either folding or going all-in? I'm unsure how this comes into play exactly.
No, "Call committal threshold" means calls which commit x% of the players stack will not be allowed (when all in is available). He will instead have to go allin.

The same way with "Fold committal threshold". Folds will not be added if more than x% of the stack is invested.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IsaacAsimov View Post


When I try to click 'Add to all' -> 'Postflop nodes', nothing happens in this instance. Can you maybe tell me how this is supposed to work?
This will add all actions selected in the checkboxes under the table graphic. So either you have no actions selected or they are all pruned out from the threshold settings.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gtlol View Post
I have a situation where i raise preflop and i want to fix the bb response. i lock from clipboard the 3 bet then i lock the fold from clipboard but the 3 bet changes. How can i lock both without changing each other while leaving call unlocked?
This will be fixed in todays update.
MonkerWare is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2017, 10:50 PM   #253
IsaacAsimov
old hand
 
IsaacAsimov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,618
Re: MonkerSolver

Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkerWare View Post
Yes, I would recommend Intel. I have no benchmarks whatsoever from AMD though, but I would expect performance to be worse with possibly the exception of ryzen.
I doubt anybody here is asking if they should use something before AM4 (so AM4/X399 vs X99/X299). I could be wrong though. Obviously X399 and X299 hasn't been released yet, but it will be soon.

So, are you saying you have some Intel benchmarks? I'd be interested in differences between some of the higher core Xeon processors and the X99 HEDT processors. To me it sounded like you were implying the 6950x (current X99 flag ship) would beat any Xeon configuration?
IsaacAsimov is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2017, 12:45 AM   #254
IsaacAsimov
old hand
 
IsaacAsimov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,618
Re: MonkerSolver

I need as much RAM to view/load a solution as to compute it right? There is no way around that?
IsaacAsimov is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2017, 05:02 AM   #255
wigglewiggle
stranger
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 2
Re: MonkerSolver

Why is the iteration/second so slow on this calculation?



At this rate to get to 10x would take a month. This is on a AWS 16 core 128gb setup.
wigglewiggle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2017, 08:23 AM   #256
MonkerWare
enthusiast
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 60
Re: MonkerSolver

Quote:
Originally Posted by IsaacAsimov View Post
I'd be interested in differences between some of the higher core Xeon processors and the X99 HEDT processors. To me it sounded like you were implying the 6950x (current X99 flag ship) would beat any Xeon configuration?
I have no benchmarks for those computers. Yes, but that is pure speculation on my part.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IsaacAsimov View Post
I need as much RAM to view/load a solution as to compute it right? There is no way around that?
Not right now, except if you have saved with compression, then you can load a given number of streets (change the "Max streets" in the load dialog.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by wigglewiggle View Post
Why is the iteration/second so slow on this calculation?



At this rate to get to 10x would take a month. This is on a AWS 16 core 128gb setup.
Things to try:
1) Uncheck synchronize in the settings panel. You can do this while running.
2) Set avg streets to 0. You have to restart to do this.
3) The run seem to barely fit in memory. Make sure you have set the -Xmx value to your amount of free memory (122g minus whatever the OS uses, not 122g) or you may experience thrashing.
MonkerWare is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2017, 10:21 PM   #257
Hoopster81
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Hoopster81's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: between the click of the light and the start of the dream
Posts: 7,251
Re: MonkerSolver

I have no idea if this is feasible, but I'm going to throw it out anyway...

It would be nice if when building a tree, you could restrict certain bet sizes to only be available on certain boards types.

For example, lets say I have 3 cbet sizes in single raised pots depending on the board. It seems like it would significantly cut down on tree size/ram requirements if I could say, "only use the 1/4 pot sizing on board type X (e.g. paired), the half pot sizing on board type Y, and pot sizing on board type Z. Seems like this could cut down a lot on RAM requirements/processing time as opposed to having all 3 sizes available for all board types unnecessarily.
Hoopster81 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2017, 11:10 PM   #258
IsaacAsimov
old hand
 
IsaacAsimov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,618
Re: MonkerSolver

How do I set maximum RAM in the MAC version? In the folder all I see is this:

IsaacAsimov is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2017, 01:59 AM   #259
IsaacAsimov
old hand
 
IsaacAsimov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,618
Re: MonkerSolver



This is a 20GB solution. It's been loading for about 10 minutes. How long are these supposed to take to load?

Update: Looks like it look 20 minutes to load approximately.

Last edited by IsaacAsimov; 06-09-2017 at 02:06 AM.
IsaacAsimov is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2017, 03:14 AM   #260
wigglewiggle
stranger
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 2
Re: MonkerSolver

Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkerWare View Post



Things to try:
1) Uncheck synchronize in the settings panel. You can do this while running.
2) Set avg streets to 0. You have to restart to do this.
3) The run seem to barely fit in memory. Make sure you have set the -Xmx value to your amount of free memory (122g minus whatever the OS uses, not 122g) or you may experience thrashing.
Any other ideas, made all three of these changes and now getting only 14k/s iterations

also does the iterations/s increase as the calculation goes on?
wigglewiggle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2017, 07:50 AM   #261
MonkerWare
enthusiast
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 60
Re: MonkerSolver

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoopster81 View Post
I have no idea if this is feasible, but I'm going to throw it out anyway...

It would be nice if when building a tree, you could restrict certain bet sizes to only be available on certain boards types.

For example, lets say I have 3 cbet sizes in single raised pots depending on the board. It seems like it would significantly cut down on tree size/ram requirements if I could say, "only use the 1/4 pot sizing on board type X (e.g. paired), the half pot sizing on board type Y, and pot sizing on board type Z. Seems like this could cut down a lot on RAM requirements/processing time as opposed to having all 3 sizes available for all board types unnecessarily.
While this would be nice, it probably will not happen any time soon due to the complexity in implementing this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IsaacAsimov View Post
How do I set maximum RAM in the MAC version? In the folder all I see is this:
Edit the "start2.sh" file, and also run it from that file. ("sh start2.sh" from a terminal).

Quote:
Originally Posted by IsaacAsimov View Post

This is a 20GB solution. It's been loading for about 10 minutes. How long are these supposed to take to load?

Update: Looks like it look 20 minutes to load approximately.
With an SSD it should take less than a minute. 20 minutes sounds bad even for a HDD. If you have antivirus running, it's possible it's contending for the disk, hampering performance.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wigglewiggle View Post
Any other ideas, made all three of these changes and now getting only 14k/s iterations

also does the iterations/s increase as the calculation goes on?
Yes, speed generally increases.

You could try to lower the settings to make the run fit comfortably in memory. If that increases the speed, then there's some sort of thrashing issue.

The speed sounds very low, but it's hard to say for sure without seeing the tree. Could you email the tree file to support@monkerware.com?
MonkerWare is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2017, 10:16 AM   #262
IsaacAsimov
old hand
 
IsaacAsimov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,618
Re: MonkerSolver

Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkerWare View Post
With an SSD it should take less than a minute. 20 minutes sounds bad even for a HDD. If you have antivirus running, it's possible it's contending for the disk, hampering performance.
This time was from a Google Cloud Compute VM. I think it runs Windows Defender by default. I don't think it is using an SSD. I don't think I configured it properly to be used with an SSD. Do you know if the lack of an SSD might otherwise affect performance? Just load times and write times right?

Update: I stopped the time properly today, and it took 29 minutes to load (actually the software tells you how long it took to load, because it's added to the run time). Would you recommended disabling Windows Defender?

Last edited by IsaacAsimov; 06-09-2017 at 10:41 AM.
IsaacAsimov is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2017, 01:32 PM   #263
Hoopster81
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Hoopster81's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: between the click of the light and the start of the dream
Posts: 7,251
Re: MonkerSolver

Quote:
Originally Posted by wigglewiggle View Post
Any other ideas, made all three of these changes and now getting only 14k/s iterations

also does the iterations/s increase as the calculation goes on?
I get the same speeds when trying to run huge preflop trees which makes them not really feasible. While it is annoying, if you think about it, it is both a blessing and a curse, really.

My suggestion is to be creative and find other ways to test all the bet sizes you want to run using multiple, smaller sims.
Hoopster81 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2017, 10:10 PM   #264
IsaacAsimov
old hand
 
IsaacAsimov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,618
Re: MonkerSolver

Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkerWare View Post
While this would be nice, it probably will not happen any time soon due to the complexity in implementing this.
How about running a postflop tree for a subset of flops? Say I can specify 10 flops that I want the same game tree for. To my understanding, as it is now I can only run flops for a single specific flop right?
IsaacAsimov is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2017, 06:29 AM   #265
IsaacAsimov
old hand
 
IsaacAsimov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,618
Re: MonkerSolver

I noticed that parts of the solution can be exported to PPT. I tried inputting these ranges into PPTOO, but the software can't handle such large ranges. I tried increasing -Xms and -Xmx directly in the JRE configuration software, but it had no effect.
I'm guessing that people are using these ranges in some other way to feed into some other software other than PPTOO or is there a way I can get PPTOO to run simulations with such large ranges?
Or is there perhaps some other way to see how much equity a specific hand has at any given point in the solution vs villain's range?
IsaacAsimov is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2017, 02:16 PM   #266
MonkerWare
enthusiast
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 60
Re: MonkerSolver

Quote:
Originally Posted by IsaacAsimov View Post
This time was from a Google Cloud Compute VM. I think it runs Windows Defender by default. I don't think it is using an SSD. I don't think I configured it properly to be used with an SSD. Do you know if the lack of an SSD might otherwise affect performance? Just load times and write times right?

Update: I stopped the time properly today, and it took 29 minutes to load (actually the software tells you how long it took to load, because it's added to the run time). Would you recommended disabling Windows Defender?
Those instances seem to use a network based filesystem by default. That will be quite slow compared to a normal local disk. Windows defender should not affect anything.
EDIT:
Right, that will only affect start/load/save times.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IsaacAsimov View Post
How about running a postflop tree for a subset of flops? Say I can specify 10 flops that I want the same game tree for. To my understanding, as it is now I can only run flops for a single specific flop right?
Running 10 flops at the same time would probably not offer any speed improvement compared to running it sequentially, while increasing RAM requirements. Running 10 flops sequentially (scripting) is on the todo-list.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IsaacAsimov View Post
I noticed that parts of the solution can be exported to PPT. I tried inputting these ranges into PPTOO, but the software can't handle such large ranges. I tried increasing -Xms and -Xmx directly in the JRE configuration software, but it had no effect.
I'm guessing that people are using these ranges in some other way to feed into some other software other than PPTOO or is there a way I can get PPTOO to run simulations with such large ranges?
Or is there perhaps some other way to see how much equity a specific hand has at any given point in the solution vs villain's range?
The equity graph takes the filter into account. So, you could filter on a specific combo and see the equity there.
MonkerWare is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-11-2017, 02:10 AM   #267
IsaacAsimov
old hand
 
IsaacAsimov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,618
Re: MonkerSolver

Would it be possible to manually set the location of the saved runs folder? It would make it a little easier to share the results between machines by setting it to a synchronized folder.

When saving runs, and selecting compression, there is a warning that says that this is not entirely lossless. I'm not sure how to interpret that. What sort of errors would this lead to potentially?
IsaacAsimov is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-11-2017, 01:43 PM   #268
A__theKevlar__2
journeyman
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 207
Re: MonkerSolver

Do the pre solved solutions available for purchase in the cloud store take rake into account?
A__theKevlar__2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-11-2017, 11:00 PM   #269
IsaacAsimov
old hand
 
IsaacAsimov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,618
Re: MonkerSolver

Do you have an nGTO solution for Omaha preflop ranges?

"MonkerViewer is a simple program used to navigate preflop ranges. Hold'em and Omaha nGTO ranges can be purchased from the store."



In the viewer itself there are no Omaha ranges for purchase.
IsaacAsimov is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-15-2017, 01:58 AM   #270
IsaacAsimov
old hand
 
IsaacAsimov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,618
Re: MonkerSolver

1) I noticed that when I load a tree with saved ranges, the percentages never quite match up with what they were when I initially input them. Today for example the ranges showed as follows:



However if I reinput the ranges, they are now as follows:



2) Do you think that a hardware configuration with dual-socket CPUs would underperform vs a single CPU with the same spec?
IsaacAsimov is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-15-2017, 04:20 PM   #271
MonkerWare
enthusiast
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 60
Re: MonkerSolver

Quote:
Originally Posted by IsaacAsimov View Post
Would it be possible to manually set the location of the saved runs folder? It would make it a little easier to share the results between machines by setting it to a synchronized folder.

When saving runs, and selecting compression, there is a warning that says that this is not entirely lossless. I'm not sure how to interpret that. What sort of errors would this lead to potentially?
You can change that in: settings->default saved run folder

No major problems, but frequencies of mixed hands may change slightly on streets where you don't have average. Unaveraged frequencies are not exact in any case, but tend to oscillate around the correct frequency, which is why averaging is useful.

Quote:
Originally Posted by A__theKevlar__2 View Post
Do the pre solved solutions available for purchase in the cloud store take rake into account?
No rake.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IsaacAsimov View Post
Do you have an nGTO solution for Omaha preflop ranges?

"MonkerViewer is a simple program used to navigate preflop ranges. Hold'em and Omaha nGTO ranges can be purchased from the store."

In the viewer itself there are no Omaha ranges for purchase.
There used to be, but that information is no longer correct.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IsaacAsimov View Post
1) I noticed that when I load a tree with saved ranges, the percentages never quite match up with what they were when I initially input them. Today for example the ranges showed as follows:

However if I reinput the ranges, they are now as follows:


2) Do you think that a hardware configuration with dual-socket CPUs would underperform vs a single CPU with the same spec?
When starting the run, the ranges will change due to combos blocked by the board cards being removed.

If they change without starting the run, there's some problem which I would be interested in how to reproduce.

2)
Yes, but I'm not sure how much. If you go back a few pages someone with a dual-socket CPU seemed not very pleased with the performance. I'm not sure how much of this could be attributed to the dual socket though.
MonkerWare is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-15-2017, 10:59 PM   #272
IsaacAsimov
old hand
 
IsaacAsimov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,618
Re: MonkerSolver

Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkerWare View Post
When starting the run, the ranges will change due to combos blocked by the board cards being removed.

If they change without starting the run, there's some problem which I would be interested in how to reproduce.
The screenshot shown was from before starting any runs and before inputting any board cards.
I am relatively sure that the combos from the saved tree are never the same as when I input them initially. I initially dismissed this, because I thought it might somehow be related to blockers. But in this case, as shown in the screenshots, the change is so dramatic, that that hypothesis didn't seem plausible any more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkerWare View Post
2)
Yes, but I'm not sure how much. If you go back a few pages someone with a dual-socket CPU seemed not very pleased with the performance. I'm not sure how much of this could be attributed to the dual socket though.
I think you are referring to the 64-cores vs 10-cores post. I thought about that too, but I'm not sure if OP was using vCPUs or a local machine. I don't know enough about CPU architecture, but intuitively, I wouldn't assume that those would perform equivalently necessarily.

I'm thinking that RAM architecture might also have a relatively large impact on Monker performance right? As in DDR4 over DDR3.
IsaacAsimov is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2017, 12:59 PM   #273
IsaacAsimov
old hand
 
IsaacAsimov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,618
Re: MonkerSolver



Is it not possible to specify ranges in trees that start before the flop?
IsaacAsimov is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2017, 11:48 PM   #274
IsaacAsimov
old hand
 
IsaacAsimov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,618
Re: MonkerSolver

How do I add a fold to a tree? I know that folds are added by default, but I removed a fold, and later decided I wanted that part of the tree back, but don't see how to do that.
IsaacAsimov is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2017, 06:32 PM   #275
lestro
grinder
 
lestro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 437
Re: MonkerSolver

Quote:
Originally Posted by IsaacAsimov View Post
How do I add a fold to a tree? I know that folds are added by default, but I removed a fold, and later decided I wanted that part of the tree back, but don't see how to do that.
Right click on "POT" in your example, and edit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IsaacAsimov View Post
Is it not possible to specify ranges in trees that start before the flop?
As far as I can tell, no. But you can lock them afterwards.
lestro is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:36 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2008-2017, Two Plus Two Interactive
 
 
Poker Players - Streaming Live Online